[solardev]

> It sounds like you don't know what to look for in Drafts.

[snip]

Yeah, exactly. It's that whole meta-game I have zero interest in (competitive card-picking, as opposed to competitive card-playing). Just different strokes for different folks and all that.

> I'd say the main problem with Draft is the unbalanced nature of it all. [...] But if everyone at the table is of roughly the same skill level, its a great format.

That makes sense, especially in MTG where there are like 20,000 cards to choose from. The P2W can definitely come out.

Ironically that's actually one of the reasons I prefer another card game, Elder Scrolls: Legends (https://bethesda.net/game/legends), a Morrowind/Oblivion-themed digital card game that's technically "collectible", but they stopped making new cards a few years ago. Now it's just the same set of a few hundred old cards, but people still keep coming up with new metas without spending any more money. It's awesome, and there are no new overpowered cards to be surprised by, just interesting new uses of them. Despite having been technically abandoned, the community is still very active (no more than 20-30 seconds to find a match, which is sometimes faster than even MTG Arena!)

I feel like MTG suffered the opposite fate, where it became a victim of its own runaway success, and draft was popularized amongst older players who got sick of trying to keep up with the incessant power creep. Is that fair?

[dragontamer]

> Now it's just the same set of a few hundred cards, but keep still come up with new metas without spending more money.

That's called a "Cube" in Magic the Gathering.

https://magic.wizards.com/en/news/feature/building-your-firs...

https://mtg.fandom.com/wiki/Cube_Draft

We draft Cubes from our old collections all the time, to help recycle our older cards.

> That makes sense, especially in MTG where there are like 20,000 cards to choose from. The P2W can definitely come out. > Now it's just the same set of a few hundred cards, but keep still come up with new metas without spending more money.

A typical Draft's card pool is only ~300ish cards or so, whatever is in the newest set. Its actually small enough to memorize.

You don't draft booster-cards from all of MtG. A Draft is innately around the ~300ish cards of some set. Lost Caverns of Ixalan only consists of 291 cards.

[solardev]

> That's called a "Cube" in Magic the Gathering.

It wasn't super clear to me from that article, but does this mean everyone drafts from the same cube (like you combine cards and then everyone draws from them)? Or does everyone make their own cubes?

I think a difference there (vs a limited number of cards in the game, period) is being able to realistically know all the cards that can be played. There's not this surprise of "what, I didn't even know this ridiculous card exists" -- everyone's seen all the cards, dozens if not hundreds of times -- but it's up to them to create new and interesting combinations of those same cards. It's more chess-like in that way and less of an arms race.

> You don't draft booster-cards from all of MtG. A Draft is innately around the ~300ish cards of some set. Lost Caverns of Ixalan only consists of 291 cards.

Right, but that only lasts a few months, right? Or is it weeks now? Getting 291 unique cards would require many cases of cards (and thousands of dollars, probably?)... I tried that for one cycle and then stopped after realizing how expensive it gets, and how quickly too.

[dragontamer]

> It wasn't super clear to me from that article, but does this mean everyone drafts from the same cube (like you combine cards and then everyone draws from them)? Or does everyone make their own cubes?

A cube is 360 (total) cards that you tell all your friends about. Some of these cards are repeats (ex: 4x Elite Vanguards).

You bring those cards, you shuffle them up, deal out 15-to-each-person, and then start drafting (pretending this random-deal of 15 is "like a booster pack").

> There's not this surprise of "what, I didn't even know this ridiculous card exists" -- everyone's seen all the cards, dozens if not hundreds of times -- but it's up to them to create new and interesting combinations of those same cards. It's more chess-like in that way and less of an arms race.

Then keep to the same cube. Make everyone in your group know what cards are in the cube, ask questions about those cards before playing.

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The "owner" of the Cube is responsible for "balance patches" (Hmmm... Red is too strong. I'll replace some of these powerful Red cards with weaker ones). So its not completely static. But the general plan is to build a set that your group can "recycle" and grow to become experts in.

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> Right, but that only lasts a few months, right? Or is it weeks now? Getting 291 unique cards would require many cases of cards (and thousands of dollars, probably?)... I tried that for one cycle and then stopped after realizing how expensive it gets, and how quickly too.

You... look at the cards before entering a draft. Ex: https://www.magicspoiler.com/mtg-set/the-lost-caverns-of-ixa...

All of this information is published ahead of time. Some, more competitive, players even playtest / draft when the spoilers are released long before the Pre-release. Using computer software to emulate a draft.

The only money you put down in each draft is the 3x Booster Packs per draft (or if you're in an official event, the entry fee which also includes a bit extra for the prize-packs)

Draft-players don't "collect" the cards. You usually sell the cards after the draft.

[solardev]

> Then keep to the same cube. The "owner" of the Cube is responsible for "balance patches" (Hmmm... Red is too strong. I'll replace some of these powerful Red cards with weaker ones). So its not completely static. But the general plan is to build a set that your group can "recycle" and grow to become experts in.

Thanks for explaining this! I actually really like this. I will suggest it to our Magic group next time :) That might just be the kind of experience we're needing.

> All of this information is published ahead of time. Some, more competitive, players even playtest / draft when the spoilers are released long before the Pre-release. Using computer software to emulate a draft.

Wait, really? I didn't know that either. So if I'm understanding you right, people basically simulate drafts (in software... any recommendations?) before the actual release? Does the software include estimated rarity, such that if you practice drafting a few times, you're as unlikely to get the rares as in the real card version?

> Draft-players don't "collect" the cards. You usually sell the cards after the draft.

This probably just goes back to the difference in preferences earlier: novelty in cards vs novelty in tactical deck-building. I prefer the latter, where you work a small pile of "knowns" and rearrange them more effectively, vs constantly having new piles of unknowns. The "curated Cube" may just be the perfect answer to that. Thanks again!

[hiddevb]

There's a large crossover between magic players and software developers, so there are a huge amount of great tools. The ones I currently use are:

- https://cubecobra.com for inspiration. There are draftbots but they are not very good. - https://draftmancer.com the ideal way to draft online or against bots

[dragontamer]

https://dr4ft.info/

https://ponymtg.github.io/cockatrice1.html

> Does the software include estimated rarity, such that if you practice drafting a few times, you're as unlikely to get the rares as in the real card version?

Yes, of course. Rarity is important to drafting strategy.

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You ain't gonna beat a top level player who has practiced drafting a set dozens of times before the release, lol.

But grow to the skill level you're comfortable with. A bit of practice goes a long way.

[solardev]

Thanks!