[buff-a]

Honda Civic 2015 EULA:

23.1.23.44 (Page 198 of 301) "Your use of this vehicle grants us your irrevocable and permanent consent to download, transmit, or otherwise obtain the information contained in the onboard data recorder, and to share that data with third parties, including but not limited to law enforcement (without a court order), and marketing companies."

[tptacek]

Sounds like a reason not to buy a 2015 Honda.

Note that Honda (and most other manufacturers) were inevitably going to put event data recorders in cars anyways. They are too cheap and they make too much sense not to have.

So without the federal rules, what you'd have is market full of cars with event data recorders and no rules regarding data ownership or requirements to disclose (this bill requires full disclosure about the devices and their purpose).

But BGR doesn't want to tell you that, because their purpose here isn't to inform, it's to generate rageviews.

[buff-a]

>Sounds like a reason not to buy a 2015 Honda.

Ah yes, the "free market" in action. That has worked so well for us in protecting our privacy, as evidenced by the plethora of commercial software with EULAs that respects the user's rights.

Or are you saying Richard Stallman is going to build us a car next?

Here's how it works:

1. Government is constitutionally forbidden from collecting this information.

2. Government observes that private corporations can collect this information.

3. Government grants private corporations immunity from prosecution and civil liability if it collects this information and hands it to the government. Threatens prosecution and civil liability if corporations fails to collect information and "something bad happens".

4. US Supreme Court pretends this is acceptable by ignoring "intent" and "consequences" and then goes on to uphold "intent" and "consequences" in every other case before it.

[fleitz]

Yeah, if you had a car you might think about driving it across a state line and buy gas in another state, therefore it's interstate commerce or something, and thus the government can do whatever it pleases.

[andylei]

which might be true except for

> (2) PRIVACY- Data recorded or transmitted by such a data recorder may not be retrieved by a person other than the owner or lessee of the motor vehicle in which the recorder is installed

also, you say

> Ah yes, the "free market" in action. That has worked so well for us in protecting our privacy, as evidenced by the plethora of commercial software with EULAs that respects the user's rights.

this bill is exactly the opposite of free market. it says everyone has to put recorders and cars and then explicitly forbids certain uses of them.

[tptacek]

It doesn't explicitly forbid use of them. Honda's EULA is lawful and binding under the new law. But the case could be made that without the new law, Honda wouldn't need a EULA (although having it probably cuts down on their legal bills).

Obviously, though: Honda's EULA is lawful and binding without the bill. This bill can only improve matters at this point. You can be irritated that it doesn't improve them enough, but that's not the case BGR is making.

[MartinCron]

their purpose here isn't to inform, it's to generate rageviews

"Rageview" may be my new favorite word. Thank you for expanding my vocabulary.

[snowwrestler]

WOW. That's a deal-breaker.

It would be interesting to get the whole way through the new car negotiating process, then strike this line right before signing. What would the reaction be? How badly does the dealership want to sell that car?

[tptacek]

Yes, this might cost a Honda dealership as many as 1 sale every 5 years.

[snowwrestler]

I didn't say that it would cost x sales in y time, or even that it would harm sales at all. My point is that it would be interesting to see the interaction between a car manufacturer's EULA, and a dealership's retail staff. I mean, do car salespeople even understand what a EULA is?

It's not like selling Windows 7 in Best Buy. The cashier at Best Buy does not care whether I hate the EULA or buy Windows. The car salesperson probably cares very much about whether I buy the car, and they probably don't care much about some random EULA term.

Granted: a bit off-topic perhaps. I would hope that such blanket permissions terms on sales contracts would be overridden by the protections written into the law. For instance I don't think health providers can undercut HIPAA protections no matter what their contractual terms say.

[AutoCorrect]

pretty simple - they (the dealership) do not have the right to modify a EULA - it would be like Best Buy accepting a EULA change for a MS software product.