[DeathArrow]

How does an investigation equal abuse? If you did no wrong, you don't have to fear any investigation about what you did with the money, and whether you deserve it or not.

By requesting welfare money, you agree that the government can investigate you.

[danielheath]

Robodebt wasn't "an investigation". It was "Our algorithm (which we know is very frequently wrong) guessed you might have money, so we've retroactively cancelled your benefits and will come after you for fraud until you can prove your innocence via an appeal process that's been deliberately obfuscated".

Governments own lawyers advised them that their plans were illegal, in advance.

[DeathArrow]

That sounds nasty. I was talking about the context about France's profiling algo.

[joshxyz]

guilty until proven innocent, yikes

[quadcore]

If you did no wrong, you don't have to fear any investigation about what you did with the money, and whether you deserve it or not.

First-hand experience here. Doesnt work like that.

How does an investigation equal abuse?

It does not in theory but in practice that is the vehicle. You have no idea what Ive been through lately via KYC in France. I was worried Id never see my money while they were making a fool out of me. It's the vehicle and if one's not a discrimination target indeed it's invisible.

[dragoncrab]

Being target of an investigation can have enormous costs.

I've been there several times.

I needed to provide ample of documents that took time to assemble and I needed to take part on in person hearings, once in a town 200 km away from my residence.

Yes, they pay for the travel and by law my employer needs to provide me extra vacation for those days, but being the guy who needs to take 2 more days again doesn't necessarily boost your career and I'm sure my family would had appreciated if I spend the weekends with them instead of reading up legalisation.

Neither case I've done anything wrong and I was always very cooperative.

I broke, when I was fined for tax evasion, presented evidence on 3 hearings that they were wrong and after they revoked the fine, I still needed to pay interest as according to law I should had paid the fine while the appeal was in progress and since I didn't, I need to pay a surcharge for the delay. Given the entire case was a huge government error I could had appeal against the surcharge, but I didn't want to go through 3 more hearings.

You can absolutely bankrupt entire families both financially and emotionally with this shit.

[pixl97]

Ok, I'm going to investigate you for child pornography as the state.

Don't worry about it when I ask your friends and coworkers about your internet browsing habits.

And oh, after all that I'll not tell anyone "Sorry, we had a mistake in the algorithm and DeathArrow had nothing to do with it at all".