[unalone]

Yeah? Why are grades that important? They show that you can do things after a professor tells you how to do it, and that you're good at busywork.

Project work shows initiative at the very least. But again: I'm not doing it for a resume. I'm going it because I have a good idea and I want to realize its potential.

[crabapple]

Why are grades that important? They show that you can do things after a professor tells you how to do it, and that you're good at busywork

why are you telling me this? just drop the fuck out now and save the money you are pissing away on tuition if you are convinced its all just a waste of time

but get used to being self-employed, because without that degree you won't even get through filter0 for any recruiter or hiring dept. hard to tell a cto how smart you are when the HR staffer shreds your resume because your last education is high school

[pg]

I don't think any of the startups we've funded care whether someone finished their degree. We certainly don't ourselves.

This is not to say grades are entirely meaningless, though. I've definitely taken a few classes where getting an A took more than obedience.

[unalone]

I guess my "obedience" line appeals more to high school than it does to college. In college, I'm having to do thinks like design a portfolio just to let my professor see my assignments, and it's taking a lot of diverse skills. In high school, grades are much more focused around busywork: several very mediocre students were ranked highly because they would do what the teacher asked to the letter, and nothing more.

I still think that projects are more valuable on a resume (or, I'd look at them more if it was up to me), because with a project you can see exactly what work was done. I can see something somebody made and understand what they place emphasis on, what details they skim over, and - to some degree - what taste they have in certain subjects. It's not valuable just because it's on the paper, but because you can glean more from a project than you can from a grade point average.

[strlen]

it's the knowledge that matters, not the grades. i am more concerned that a project like this could make 'unalone' work more for the grade (or the degree) vs. for the knowledge.

there were also many cases where i've felt that getting a higher grade would mean i'd end up learning less - as in, i'd focus on completing projects/assignments/memorizing what's needed immediately for the test vs. focusing on truly understanding the material and how it would apply to the real world.

this quarter of graduate school i'm also taking twice my normal load while still working full time: reason is one of the courses i am taking is only offered once every few years. this could mean a lower grade, but i'd end up walking away with greater knowledge.

[axod]

There are many ways to show that you have perseverance. Going through university/college is but one.

Also IMHO college/university has to be one of the best places to meet like minded people.

If your aim in life is to work at a company where you have to tick boxes and go through a hiring dept which hires you based on some grades, then sure - get the grades.

Personally I've never been at an interview where they care what grades I've got, they care what I've done, and what I've built.

[johns]

I don't have a college degree and I've been gainfully employed and well-paid for many years now.

[jawngee]

?

I'm the CTO for a 20 person startup. I only went to one year of college. Art school even.

[unalone]

Oh? I'd be interested in your story.

[jawngee]

I was in the right place at the right time.

Went to an art school for their writing program (wanted to be a writer) and they cancelled it the year I got there. I sat in the computer lab (this is 1993) and taught myself everything I could about anything related to computers. I mean I literally hung out in the labs for 12-14 hours a day.

I learned to write software that year using SuperCard and writing extensions in Pascal. My college was the second college in Minnesota (the U of M being the other) to get internet access. No graphical web yet and you could only access it on NeXT boxes, of which we had an entire lab.

Wrote what I can safely say is the first graphical instant messenger application. Worked on the local LAN via AppleTalk. It didn't catch on, but when I saw ICQ several years later I kicked myself in the pants for not pursuing it.

I got kicked out of school for not going to classes but was offered a job in the labs by the dean right after he booted me. I turned it down.

Six months later, a professor tracked me down and hired me to work at his digital photography studio (one of the few to have the hasselblad $15K digital leif-back). Built my first website in 1995, three days after Netscape 2 was released.

Haven't looked back since.

Some people do need to go to college though. Some people don't. Timing is as important as the ability to teach yourself. Being OCD totally helps. Ambition, timing and a little luck are the most important things.

YMMV.