[kyahwill]

I somehow agree with this. As a web developer who started on a framework first approach (Vue + Django), I was having one hell of a time trying to figure things out because of my lack of fundamental knowledge. I think abstraction is okay but you have to understand that just because you can make abstractions doesnt mean you should.

[mordae]

A young colleague of mine who has also started "framework first" with Vue + Django was recently confused about what a "serializer" was. They have "written some" within Django REST framework, but he was confused about their purpose.

I had to explain the problem with a single wire signalling bits in a series, recipient having to de-serialize them into some data structure. Then I had to explain that TCP emulates such a single wire using small packets.

I think that they have understood, but it was a funny feeling explaining this to someone who routinely deserializes form and JSON data, then serializes them into SQL queries, then deserializes query results in order to serialize them into templates or JSON.

[mrkeen]

I had a similar starting point (spring web apps), but reached a different conclusion.

The layers and layers of indirection obscured what HTTP is for me, and it took me too long to understand it.

Have a look at https://learnbchs.org/easy.html for a real "oh that's what HTTP is?" moment.

[mordae]

I usually teach HTTP with `nc example.com 80` and then `nc -lp 8080` plus a browser.