[lazide]

If they actually put in writing ‘Remote is forever’, then later try to fire you for refusing to return to the office - what judge in the world is going to rule in their favor?

If course, they rarely actually say that. But some folks have definitely been dumb enough to do so.

The issue with contract law is that most folks never put things in writing, so it’s a pain to litigate many claims, which makes it uneconomic to recover damages.

But if it’s in writing? Sounds like an easy to show breach of contract to me!

[soco]

Often it might be in writing as a company newsletter or communicated in a call, but not in writing as your employment contract. Mine was always vague on how much can be spent in home office (was never a problem, then or now) and I assume it might be often the case for other companies. Thus anything the management allows or requires is possible and no judge will decide on the basis of a newsletter. So I'm afraid in the end you only can vote with your feet.

[lazide]

Sounds like they were smart about it in the case you’re talking about, both in word and in action.

Flexibility (both in being able to say yes, and no) is important. Not being abusive is important too.

A lot of folks have lost their minds over the last few years (more than most), and it’s going to be interesting for sure how this all plays out.

[_puk]

Granted. If you want something set in stone, add it to your contract.

If it's a general policy that "we are remote", but your contract wasn't updated to reflect that, then don't be surprised if it changes.

[lazide]

If the general policy is updated to ‘remote is forever’, save a copy - that’s part of your contract too!

If it gets changed in a way that causes you injury, guess what - you can be and should be compensated. If you can prove these things, then it should even be relatively easy to do so.

Contract law is not just things that say ‘contract’ on them. It is about agreements between parties.

Also, talk to a lawyer so they can look over the fine print and applicable statutes. They matter.

[abustamam]

When people say "talk to a lawyer" how does one go about finding a lawyer? Like in this case, would it be an employment lawyer, a contract lawyer? And what sorts of rates could we expect? Obviously it varies depending on the contract, but I always see people advise that people talk to a lawyer when doing XYZ which makes sense, but I never understood the exact process for this.

[lazide]

Very good question. If you ask your friends, a good reference can help. Most people don’t have any attorneys on retainer, let alone know if they’re good or not though.

Usually what I’ve done is brute force. Every State has a State bar that usually has listings. Google Maps searches for ‘employment attorney near me’ or ‘civil law attorney near me’ also usually gives a lot of matches.

I dump it all into a spreadsheet, and then go down the list taking notes and calling each one. Attorneys should give a free consult (anywhere from 15 minutes to an hour).

Try to learn as much as you can about the applicable law and the situation; and ask questions. Not just what is legal/not-legal, but their history in getting actual results for clients and what the courts will actually take seriously or not.

Don’t pick anyone right away. Call at least 3, preferably 10 in each speciality.

If you like them and they like you, they’ll either take you on contingency or ask you to give them a retainer (funds to be put into a trust they can bill against). Either way there will be some paperwork they’ll have you sign before they’re ’your attorney’.

Additionally, some things to look out for -

1) anyone that makes you pay up front for a consultation is bad news. Run away.

2) anyone that promises a result is bad news. Run away.

3) Anyone who takes a case without asking specific questions and arguing with you sometimes is bad news. Run away.

4) anyone who tells you something that seems wrong (and you can’t verify independently, even after you ask for a reference) is probably bad news. Run away if you even suspect it.

Employment law is its own speciality.

Contract law is generally a subset of civil law. Civil law is a huge umbrella, from ‘my neighbors tree dropped a branch on my house’ to ‘the mega corp. in my county has been poisoning the water for decades and I got cancer’. You’ll run across attorneys who handle many different areas, ask them what they do and what their style is.

I hope this helps!

P.S. most states and countries put their laws online. There is still usually case laws which modify it, and gotchas, etc. but you can figure out 95% of it if you find them and do your own research. Leginfo.ca.gov is the California One. When you’re talking to attorneys, feel free to ask them for applicable cases and/or codes to start looking at.