[nzoschke]

This is my hypothesis too.

I participated in YC S15.

We all quit our jobs, and my co-founders moved to from Atlanta to SF for the summer, we rented a big house as a live/work space, and drove together to Mountain View the required few times a week. We went to a lot of optional things together like additional office hours, parties, meetups, together and in person.

That level of commitment and pretty much daily face to face working time is powerful.

It's not possible for everyone given circumstances, and its not sustainable forever. But that means that the teams that can and do opt into a summer like this are very committed to their idea.

So it's not hard to imagine it's "better" to relocate for a stretch of something hard like getting a business off the ground than doing it all fully distributed.

[ilrwbwrkhv]

This. People underestimate physical proximity while doing challenging things together. This has been a core human glue for millenia. One of the reasons I still recommend people to go to university. There is simply no substitute for this.

[mdekkers]

YC would have me leave my family behind for an extended period of time. The unspoken YC mantra is that startups are for the young, relatively well off, and unattached. The fact that many accelerators globally follow the YC template means that this particular type of route to learning and launching are closed to many people.

So yeah, it isn’t possible for many, if not most people. I’m not a fan of the model.

[jrowen]

I mean, we all make choices and sacrifices. Having a family is a serious commitment. There's a limited amount of time in everyone's day, you can't commit yourself to everything, and I think it's reasonable that starting a startup a la YC requires a lot of commitment (that's their model and principles, there's plenty of other opportunities out there). Being an astronaut is closed off to a lot of people because they didn't fully commit themselves to it, that's just how it goes.

[mdekkers]

> Having a family is a serious commitment. There's a limited amount of time in everyone's day, you can't commit yourself to everything

Comparing “move to another city (or country) for three months” with “there is a limited amount of time in everyone’s day” is a rather disingenuous way to frame the discussion. You make it sound like it _must_ be a zero-sum game when it doesn’t have to be.

The YC (and by extension, all YC-like) model comes across more as a system of selection and control for a specific demographic that has little to do with potential for success.

[jrowen]

I mean, if everyone's copying them, it's hard to argue that they haven't hit on something that works better than the known alternatives.

Have people tried remote accelerators? If they're viable and competitive then they should have no problem flourishing, especially given the apparent number of WFH diehards. Honestly I wouldn't bet on it.

What if you want to be an actor, or a comic, or a filmmaker? You basically have to move to LA or NY. There are lots of opportunities that require very large commitments. You can think of your commitments, hobbies, routines, each on average occupying a certain percentage of your day. Having a kid is a huge one. Doing a hustle growth startup is another. Is it really reasonable to try and do both at the same time? One or both will suffer.

[mdekkers]

> if everyone's copying them

Thats not what I said.

> it's hard to argue that they haven't hit on something that works better than the known alternatives.

Does it work better though? Barring some statistical outliers such as unicorns, VC backed startups from accelerators don’t measurably do better at all for the founders.

> What if you want to be an actor, or a comic, or a filmmaker? You basically have to move to LA or NY.

So, actors only work in […checks notes…] LA or NY?

This kind of egregious reductionism as support for the idea that a startup can only be successful if you dedicate your entire life to it to the exclusion of literally everything else (family, hobbies, “routines” - whatever that may mean) is not giving me the feeling that you are interested in a meaningful discussion, this is more like reddit point-scoring, which is not interesting, so I’m leaving it at this.

[jrowen]

What is the meaningful distinction between "many accelerators globally follow the YC template" and "everyone's copying them"?

Does it work better though? Barring some statistical outliers such as unicorns, VC backed startups from accelerators don’t measurably do better at all for the founders.

Ok, then what's the problem? Just don't do it, easy. You started this off by lamenting that they ask for too much of a commitment, now you're saying that they don't really add value. I'm not sure what argument you're driving at.

"Egregious reductionism"? Who's point-scoring again? That sentiment about e.g. Hollywood is pretty widespread conventional wisdom. Can you make it elsewhere, sure, but that's beside the point. My point is that there are certain jobs and opportunities that require a lot of commitment and giving up of other things, and that closes them off to a lot of people, but that's ok. You've avoided making any argument against that by nitpicking and shifting your argument.

Nobody is stopping anybody from living a family life in the suburbs and starting a VC backed startup in their spare time. Be a rebel, buck the trend, prove 'em wrong! But maybe understand that there may be some truth to the idea that you're putting yourself at a disadvantage in an already tough environment, and that getting a bunch of people together in the same room and grinding actually does have value, it's not just toxic YC bro culture or whatever.

exclusion of literally everything else (family, hobbies, “routines” - whatever that may mean)

Routines are things like brushing your teeth, showering, sleeping; eating may even be considered a routine. You have a very real time budget you have to balance. You seem unwilling to accept this. Go ahead, do it all, I wish you luck!

[RestlessMind]

> You make it sound like it _must_ be a zero-sum game when it doesn’t have to be.

The core hypothesis is that the startup team should be working in person to be more effective. If one doesn't agree with that, they have a great market opportunity - start "YC, but fully remote". YC is not going to compete there it seems.

[mdekkers]

I was talking about the notion you can either have a family, or start a VC business, but not both, which is the point the poster was making.