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by closewith 1010 days ago
> Anything that includes France, Germany, Italy, and Spain, will inevitably drag everyone else one way or another.

Maybe so, but whatever it became wouldn't be the EU and wouldn't include most of the current members states. It's obviously still an impossibility, as there is no appetite in any of those four countries for a federal EU.
1 comments
toyg 1010 days ago
You're making up your "obvious" reality there. EU federalism was born in France and remains strong in the other three countries I mentioned - it might not be a clear majority at the moment, but it's definitely a popular idea among large swaths of the population. The evolution of EU structures undeniably goes in that direction year after year, with stronger and stronger federal institutions.
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closewith 1009 days ago
> You're making up your "obvious" reality there.

There has never been even a hint of a popular federal movement in any of the countries which you mentioned, so I don't think I am.

> EU federalism was born in France and remains strong in the other three countries I mentioned - it might not be a clear majority at the moment, but it's definitely a popular idea among large swaths of the population.

That's a bold claim that I'm sure you'll be able to back up?

Honestly, I think you've allowed your own preferences and wishful thinking to cloud your judgement here.

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toyg 1009 days ago
> There has never been even a hint of a popular federal movement in any of the countries which you mentioned

It depends on your definition of "popular movement", but there have been plenty of popular leaders arguing for federalization, from Briand onwards. Just recently: https://www.euractiv.com/section/politics/short_news/german-...

> a bold claim that I'm sure you'll be able to back up?

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/14651165221101505 - this paper explicitly sets out to find non-federalist views, reporting that 44% hold "traditional" views (federalists and separatists), which would indicate federalism is about 20-25% of the population - that's a "large swath", in my book. And that's pure-federalism; the generic support that can likely be turned is much higher.

I mean, that's just a random source. The news focus on anti-europe trends these days because, for so long, pro-europe ones were the mainstream default.

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closewith 1009 days ago
Your source doesn't at all support your claim. Meanwhile, there is no indication in any polling that any of the countries you mention have even single-digit support for federalisation.

As I said, you've either blinded yourself or you're intentionally dishonest.

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toyg 1008 days ago
Lol, keep talking. Meanwhile, actual federalists continue doing the work set up by Brand, Schuman, De Gasperi etc, almost a century ago. For example: https://european-union.europa.eu/principles-countries-histor...
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