[EricMausler]

If they bought a prefab house which was sold to many people in the neighborhood, and part of the terms and conditions were do not open up the walls, and the owner opened up all the walls to find out weakspots it can be robbed, then that does seem criminal, no?

However, the owner should still have a right to validate the security of his house - so he should be able to request for permission to break the terms of his contract for the sake of security research. That is going to require approval from the company, who the contract is with. I think we should be looking to make some laws around making sure this communication can happen safely and fairly

[solidsnack9000]

At present, I'm not sure it's actually possible to sell someone a house with terms like that, since it would interfere with ordinary, even essential aspects of maintaining a liveable dwelling. It does highlight the oddity of the situation we are in with many IoT devices.

[EricMausler]

Yes exactly with the weirdness. Which is why I am leaning heavily into being a proponent of it needing some laws created explicitly for this situation that will clarify what's considered fair activity between researchers, companies, repairers, etc.

Sticking with the example, there is not reason a company cannot have terms that you can't open the walls, while the state also has laws that regardless of what the terms are - you are allowed to open the walls for maintenence purposes, renovations, etc, but maybe you have to notify the company about what you are doing.

It feels like territory somewhere in between the complete freedom of ownership and the total lockdown of renting.

I'd imagine there is a whole legal tug of war that would need to happen to know where the lines would or should fall, but the main point is that both sides are at the table and no one needs to be keeping their activity in the dark because of how uncertain they are about how the law is going to treat them