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by feoren 1030 days ago
Hot take: the industry as a whole is very bad at both front-end and back-end. They both have their intrinsic challenges, but the discipline of software engineering is so immature that the self-imposed / accidental complexity dwarfs the essential complexity. We could all be doing much, much better at both.

Front-end technologies are not "progressing rapidly", they are thrashing. People are (rightfully) extremely frustrated with the limitations of the tools they have, so they (wrongfully) go off and invent new tools that get around those limitations, while inevitably re-introducing tons of difficulty in whatever the tools they're replacing were developed to avoid. It's just around and around. Developers aren't falling behind, they're simply getting dizzy. What they should be doing, instead of throwing out all the babies with all the bathwater and going and inventing their own giant frameworks with Blackjack and Hookers, is working on the theory of software engineering.

Our theories of software engineering are terrible, and I very rarely see discussions where I see actual theory-building. There are a lot of religious discussions, and a lot of slick new tools that let newbies make cool things quickly but always make complicated things harder. We need better theories of software engineering, not more new JavaScript frameworks and NoSQL database engines.

So don't worry about which one is harder than the other. It's an arbitrary line anyway, and it depends way too heavily on the specifics of the project. Realize that by and large, almost everyone is still shit at the entire stack.

4 comments

> Front-end technologies are not "progressing rapidly", they are thrashing. People are (rightfully) extremely frustrated with the limitations of the tools they have, so they (wrongfully) go off and invent new tools that get around those limitations, while inevitably re-introducing tons of difficulty in whatever the tools they're replacing were developed to avoid. It's just around and around.

I feel this is an obsolete view. React has been on top since what, 2017? It's extremely popular and there's nothing close to it. Now, data world... amount of new technologies there has way overtaken early 10s frontend.

> I feel this is an obsolete view. React has been on top since what, 2017?

React is obsolete. Cool kids are now using Svelte or Qwik.

Just to put things in perspective, here are last week’s NPM download numbers for those three frameworks[1]:

React: 21,879,845

Svelte: 722,312

Qwik: 11,702

[1] https://npmtrends.com/@builder.io/qwik-vs-react-vs-svelte

I think the hardest part for these new libraries is to build a solid ecosystem around them. React is the king for now and it will take many years to catch up.
We have not reached the same level of usability as VB6, Delphi, and WinForms, where you can drag and drop buttons and textboxes onto a form, click to add some code behind them, and have stuff just happen.

Web front-end is horrific by comparison.

What are some examples of fields in the theory of software engineering?
it seems appropriate to mention htmx ~ Essays: https://htmx.org/essays/