[gsatic]

With this stuff everything boils down to how you answer a simple question (which usually most people hardly think about or are encouraged to think about) which is - Do you know how to produce Faith?

In yourself (or others). Faith that you can do things, no one including yourself thinks you can.

If you sit down and think about that question, and spend time experimenting with different answers, what you will come up with, wont be too different from what all the religions of the world or djoko comes up with to generate Faith. Which is stories. myths. imagery. rituals etc. The more faith you need to generate the more absurd the methods can look to an external observer. But what matters is not the absurdity (especially if its not hurting anyone else) but whether the methods have caused your Faith gauge to see an uptick.

So go try and see what you come up for yourself or for someone else, next time there is a big challenge ahead. It will help you understand what you see others trying to do.

[romesmoke]

Can someone please explain to me why this comment has been downvoted? Because to my eyes it is 100% relevant to the post, well-written, does not insult anyone, is elaborate, and potentially helpful for others.

The only answer I can buy right now is some allergy to the word "faith", especially if it comes with a capital F. Which is quite a pity: if we dare to be honest enough about it, even the hardest-core atheist/rationalists are driven by faith.

[Capricorn2481]

The comment didn't offend me and I didn't downvote it, but Faith only has anything to do with success if you squint. There are so many tennis players with faith who will never reach the level Djokovic has, and to ponder that he's right about the patch forces us to consider that people that haven't reached his level just don't have enough faith in themselves, forgetting other variables like genetics, training, circumstance.

Furthermore, there are lots of people who are cautious, practical, and carry some imposter syndrome, but still enjoy lots of success. Faith can certainly be motivating, but it's not the end all be all.

If it seems like there's an allergy to the concept, it has less to do with religion and more to do with the fact that putting faith in ones destiny above all else tends to be adjacent to people that are delusional about the effort they need to actually put in to the task, and see any criticism of their skill as a personal attack on their identity, and not helpful feedback on their output. For every Djokovic, there are 1000 people that are delusional about how little they are actually trying to fulfill the story they tell themselves, and it can be genuinely exhausting to see as a supporter of these people. We wouldn't accept a subpar programmer who was certain he was the next John Carmack because his crystals told him so, unless the work was speaking for itself

[romesmoke]

Thank you for your response. We'd need a podcast to unpack everything, but I appreciate your willingness to be constructive--thus I'll try to give my 2 cents and call it a day.

> [...] Faith only has anything to do with success if you squint. I understand that the original post puts "success" on its title, and hence justifies your wording. But I find success irrelevant to the discussion that the--not any more--downvoted comment hinted towards. Secular achievements are mere byproducts of a Faith-fueled life in my view. Reconciliation with the prospect of death, defeat of despair, and the sense of a life well and fully lived, are more at the center.

> [...] putting faith in ones destiny above all else tends to be adjacent to people that are delusional about the effort they need to actually put in to the task. Not my experience at all. It has to do with the weight and meaning one puts on words, I guess. Yes, Faith means, at least according to Kierkegaard, that everything is possible. But as regards the needed effort to attain said everything, if it's downplayed by the actor then it's not Faith we're talking about--but rather, as you say, delusion. If anything is implied by Faith, it's seriousness.

I am with you on your point about judging programmers according to their provable merit. I am certainly not with you on framing Faith as "being certain he's the next John Carmack". I believe lots of people carry the same misconception, and it's a fact that saddens me.

BTW, I ceased being an Orthodox Christian a long time ago, and was quite fervent about religion until that point. I am not trying to any dogma here, other than that Faith breeds Greatness if done right.