[alexlesuper]

I think zoning is a big part of the problem. Before WW2, it was much easier to build the housing that new immigrants needed when they arrived. Toda, there is miles of red tape and zoning regulations that keep new neighborhoods from forming and maturing. It's a real shame.

[ungruntled]

I’m sure there is a lot more available space than the city lets on. You can see residential luxury high-rises where most of lights on every floor are off at night. Nobody is living in them. 10s of empty rent controlled units in each of many buildings where those units stay empty for years.

The city may be struggling to house these migrants, but I’m sure there is a strong incentive to keep normal housing units unavailable so friends of politicians can fill their low demand hotel rooms and supply catering at very favorable rates.

[colonCapitalDee]

> You can see residential luxury high-rises where most of lights on every floor are off at night. Nobody is living in them.

Most people turn their lights off at night?

[mathgeek]

I believe they’re referring to the evening hours after dark, rather than after midnight.

[jinushaun]

But it’s New York… Why are you home instead of a bar or restaurant?

[SAI_Peregrinus]

Houston, Tx is a good counterexample to the generic "zoning is the problem" idea.

[xboxnolifes]

Houston has zoning if we define zoning as "rules that define where you can build, what you can build, and what auxiliary details you must include". They just don't call it zoning.

More importantly, near everyone arguing for change in zoning aren't saying that zoning should be abolished, just changed. So, Houston is not a counter-example.

[bombcar]

Houston has zoning by other names (mainly land covenants).

[PM_me_your_math]

Where are you going to build housing in the boroughs?

[lotsofpulp]

The bigger problem is there is only one New York City, and zoning is one issue that prevents another New York City from coming into existence.

[seanmcdirmid]

Everyone wants to live in NYC and they can’t. So I guess your ideas are to build more desirable cites to live in to take the pressure off of NYC?

[lotsofpulp]

Yes, there is no comparable city to NYC in the US, especially with the subway and density.

[seanmcdirmid]

That’s true. But there are lots of cities in the USA that aren’t considered very desirable and so have surplus housing.

[genman]

Maybe those cities are not desirable for a reason?

[ok_dad]

Upwards

[ChumpGPT]

>I think zoning is a big part of the problem.

I don't think so. The problem is simply to many refugees for the infrastructure/system to absorb. Do we build 10's of 1000's of housing units for future refugee's and immigrants every year, where are the funds for these units procured?

My grandfather slept in a park on a bench when he arrived after WW2 as a DP. No one provided him with anything, he had to look for work, find a way to feed himself and finally he managed to split a room in a rooming house with 2 other people. He said the bed they slept in was always warm because someone was getting up to go to work and someone came home from work and was going to sleep. Many families lived the same way. What's interesting is they had no social assistance or help of any kind. Today there is a belief these types of people should be provided with everything. It just isn't plausible.

[FirmwareBurner]

>Today there is a belief these types of people should be provided with everything. It just isn't plausible.

Living standards were lower back then and WW2 USA was far less wealthy than it is today. Now it can afford to provide humane present-day conditions to people until they can find work and housing themselves. Just count the money the US spent on the war on terror and the war on drugs, it's more than the GDP of some countries.

Refugees don't want hand-outs, they want opportunities to work and provide for themselves. If you deny them decent opportunities and humane living conditions from the start, they're guaranteed to turn to crime to survive, then everyone looses.

[SenAnder]

I don't know about WW2 USA, but 1970s USA was wealthier - wages have not kept up with house prices [1], car prices, education, gas [2], or rent [2,3]. But GDP is up...

[1] https://old.reddit.com/r/lostgeneration/comments/fgkb83/its_...

[2] https://old.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/comments/439mr8/e...

[3] https://www.apartmentlist.com/rentonomics/rent-growth-since-...

[haldujai]

I assume you’re not trying to be intentionally misleading but those graphs do not support your assertion that the US, presumably referring to the average American, is less wealthy today.

You can’t just cherry pick things that have become more expensive and ignore the many things that are cheaper when making such a general assertion.

Here is a better source for your reference:

In comparing household incomes of the middle class in the United States in 1980 to today, we conclude that real incomes for today’s middle class are somewhat higher than they used it to be, particularly for households headed by two adults. It is also clear that failing to adjust for demographic shifts in the population relating to age, race, and education can indicate a more positive outlook than is truly the case.

We find, as in prior research, that prices in housing, healthcare, and education have risen more than middle-class incomes and so are relatively more expensive. However, we also find that these price increases are offset by relative price decreases in transportation, food, and recreation, among others, making real middle-class incomes slightly higher than in the past.

https://www.clevelandfed.org/en/publications/economic-commen...

[FirmwareBurner]

>I don't know about WW2 USA, but 1970s USA was wealthier

You mean the average american was wealthier in 1977. The USA of today is wealthier than the USA of 1977, just that the wealth in more unevenly spread. Maybe fixing wealth inequality is something to look into, but who am I kidding, we both know that aint gonna happen.

[ChumpGPT]

>Refugees don't want hand-outs, they want opportunities to work and provide for themselves. If you deny them decent opportunities and humane living conditions from the start, they're guaranteed to turn to crime to survive, then everyone looses.

Isn't that what American citizens want, those same opportunities. Perhaps, they also deserve what you want to give to refugees.

[cassepipe]

Well it seemed that a lot of American citizens who could have benefited from basic societal relief have voted against their own interests repeatedly. Whether they are aware of it or emotionally manipulated into it is left as an exercise to the reader.

[chrismcb]

"... In a rooming house..." Personally I think this is part of the problem today. We no longer have rooming houses. We no longer have really cheap housing due to zoning and other regulations.

[anyonecancode]

Many of the migrants arriving in New York would like to be working -- they didn't come to hang around in city shelters for months at a time. But they can't, legally. Part of the solution seems like it should involve making it easier to let people who want to work, work.

(see eg https://news.cornell.edu/media-relations/tip-sheets/expedite... -- 6 months before they can even apply for a work permit!)

[morelisp]

Benches are now designed to be impossible to sleep on, plus park cops will kick you out if you try.

[FirmwareBurner]

so the system says "f*ck poor people, gotta kick them while their down"?