[gen220]

I think Go is on that Java/.NET adoption curve, but it's climbing it slowly because backend programming, as a whole, is a lot bigger, mature and diverse today, than it was when Java/.NET emerged.

I think there's a decent chance that, `[java.age - go.age = 15 years]` from today, Go is high up on the totem pole. From my perspective, its ecosystem is vibrant but still young – we still need to decide on the Go equivalent of Flask, Django, Spring, etc.

[guggle]

There are plenty of Flask equivalent in Go IMO. Django... not so much.

[gen220]

Yep! I think, at this stage, `plenty` is the point of my comment. While there are many competing and quality options (vibrant), none of them are the de facto leader (young).

I think, given where we are in 2023, it'd be difficult for a Django (i.e. ORM + templates + web framework all-in-one) to emerge in Go – it's possible we never end up with one, and that's OK. [I don't think there's much stomach for good people to work on sprawling projects like that anymore – we're in an season of backend development that favors separation (vs bundling) of concerns, from my perspective].

I'm not sure if it's a unique feature of the Go ecosystem that there isn't one clear winner in the "minimalist + pluggable web framework" or "ORM" categories, or if we just need to wait for the winner to emerge. Ironically, I think the quality of `net/http` and `database/sql` might have been an anti-catalyst for the development of leading libraries in those verticals.

[guggle]

> we're in an season of backend development that favors separation (vs bundling) of concerns

I work in a small team (5 developers), on multiple projects that span from 3 months to 1 year of work. While I like some of Go qualities (like speed, types, low memory, easy deployment,...) it would be hard for me to introduce Go to the team. The thing is that with Django (or Laravel, or Rails, or any "opiniated" framework) I can point the team to a nice single documentation website and associated framework that covers probably 90 to 95% of our needs and gets us right into the business logic real fast. There's real value in framework integration for teams like us (and for this very reason, we don't use Flask either, way to much fiddling). Also, the feature set in these solutions, while maybe "out of season", is fine for most of our projects.

At this point, should I want to push Go to the team, I would have integrate libraries myself and document... so basically starting my own version of a "framework". Like you said, it's a sprawling project. But hey... isn't it how Django started ? Maybe one day...

Meanwhile, I'll stick to using Go in my personal projects, until I have a very clear picture of the ecosystem.

[coffeebeqn]

You also don’t need to have frameworks for everything when the std library delivers