[tredre3]

> but they do exist.

And here's the crux of it, isn't it? Unless it's accessible and enabled by default, it might as well not exist from the PoV of the end user.

Windows' restore points happen automatically before updates or driver updates. Then you're prompted automatically to restore if Windows fails to boot after an update.

As usual Linux has all the pieces but no desire to create UX to go with it. Which is a shame because ZFS with automatic snapshotting daily or before major events combined with a simple UI that can run in the preboot environment would be a game changer and make Windows look like a toy.

[dizhn]

OpenSUSE Tumbleweed has this. The installer defaults to btrfs and snapshots using snapper. Snapshots are automatic before and after every package manager operation. Save for something that breaks grub, you can always recover.

[bravetraveler]

In that spirit, if you have an EFI system, you don't need GRUB

[boomboomsubban]

You sort of do if you want to boot kernels on btrfs. Refind is an option, but not most of the other EFI bootloaders.

[bravetraveler]

Ah, good point - I neglected the BTRFS involvement/need to find kernels... that one would ideally include with these snapshots, of course

[account42]

You put the kernel (built with efistub) directly onto the EFI partition - no boot loaded needed at all.

[boomboomsubban]

Which kind of ruins bootable snapshots, as your kernel isn't part of them. You could have a massive esp with ~10 unified kernels each pointing at a different snapshot, with some kind of management script to handle them, but using GRUB seems easier than that.

[Pesthuf]

I think there's still value in a bootloader. You can easily load an old kernel with an old initramfs if you messed up somehow, or adjust kernel parameters.

The boot UI for most modern UEFI-Firmwares is really primitive and they usually don't come with EFI shells.

[dizhn]

Can you point to read-only snapshots that way?

[vladvasiliu]

> And here's the crux of it, isn't it? Unless it's accessible and enabled by default, it might as well not exist from the PoV of the end user.

For what it's worth, at one point Ubuntu supported installing on ZFS through its regular installer and installed the boot environment thingy, with a snapshot before every update. I have one such machine which is now running 23.04 and that still works. I've never had to use in practice, though.

[hef19898]

Oh, so this! Having had the option last Friday to just reboot into whatever it was before said update, and just skip the next couple of updates, man, that would have been great!