[knightofmars]

Alcohol is a potential catalyst and not a cause in these situations. There are underlying problems with people's psyche that lead to abusive outcomes. Add in centuries of religion supporting and encouraging the beating of wives and children who don't submit it's no wonder we as a species ended up where we are. Even Ghandi who was teetotaler hit his wife.

Point being, like anything, it's complex. Yes, alcohol is a factor in abuse. But it's not the cause.

[fragmede]

If you think harmful things it doesn't count. it's only when thoughts are verbalized or become actions that there's a problem. Where a person, when sober, isn't abusive and doesn't hit people, but does when drunk, is say alcohol is the cause. if they're mean abusive drunks who can lay off the sauce, then they're actually okay people and it doesn't matter that they're mean and abusive when drunk.

I say this as the grandchild of an alcoholic. Alcohol is the problem. You're right that there're underlying things, but they lie there, just beneath the surface, mostly untouched and undisturbing without alcohol.

[DropInIn]

No sh-t

The context was the impacts of X substance vs Y substance, right?

In all cases the actual cause is the underlying problems but it's the substance that (is perceived as) causes the manifestation that otherwise wouldn't occur, right?

So what purpose did your comment actually serve into he thread other than to derail an extant line of discourse?

[knightofmars]

I suspect this is a case of under communication on both are parts.

What I saw, you ended on a very vague set of statements that I assume were supposed to support that you were saying.

"Alcohol was far more popular and consistently harmful..."

Implication of alcohol being more harmful without evidence to support the claim.

History tells us lots of stories. For example, just because the temperance movement existed doesn't mean anything other than a bunch of people got it in their head that alcohol was the devil's drink and caused all of society's ills.

You also ended with an appeal to emotion, "Just ask the wives..." Instead of again supporting your claim that alcohol is more damaging with evidence.

To be clear, I'm not saying alcohol is or isn't more damaging. I'm saying that there isn't any evidence in these comments (yours and others) to support a claim of "X being worse than Y".

[DropInIn]

Opium addicts pass out, alcoholics beat and rape thier wives.

That's a line straight out of the temperance era.

I don't know why I needed to be more explicit....