[nerdbert]

> Fun fact, a resistive heating device is a rare case of something being 100% electrically efficient in that all the energy it uses will be turned into heat

My understanding is that you get considerably more heating per watt-hour with a heat pump than with resistive heating, though. I get that it's not creating that heat but moving it, but still that seems like even more efficiency from the perspective of energy consumption per useful heat made available.

[thrashh]

Well the word “efficient” always needs context. You have to define the goal first before you can define efficiency.

OP said electrical efficient so the goal is conversion of electricity to heat and it’s 100% efficient.

Even an electric heater compared to a propane heater is more electrically and energy efficient, but it’s not as storage-efficient (because fossil fuel gases have much higher energy density per volume AND weight than lithium batteries).

A heat pump is more electric bill-efficient.

[nerdbert]

> OP said electrical efficient so the goal is conversion of electricity to heat and it’s 100% efficient.

I am not an engineer and I am only nitpicking to have fun, so don't engage me if it's not fun, but doesn't some of the energy go into degradation of the materials used to build the device?

[samtho]

Yes, but energy is not consumed by that process, it is only converted into heat. The degradation usually is a result of the heat produced. If we’re talking about mater to energy transitions, we need to start talking about special relativity.

I said 100% electrical efficiency because from the prongs of the plug, through the conductors in the appliance cord, the rheostat, all electrical connection and contact points, and of course the hearing element itself all will product heat as a consequence of electricity flowing through, and being resisted by, it’s various components.

It was pointed out that this does not mean “energy bill efficient” which is totally correct: this whole thing is a somewhat silly thought experiment to consider what it really means for something to be efficient.

[coderenegade]

The coefficient of performance of a heat pump isn't a measure of thermodynamic efficiency, because as you pointed out, a heat pump moves heat rather than creating it. That's why you get more heat per Watt-hour, because you aren't expending energy trying to make heat.

The closest analogy that I know of is in electrochemical processes where some of the energy input is allowed to take different forms. If you put in 85 units of electrical energy, 15 units of waste heat from a different process, and get 90 units worth of product, your process is 90% thermodynamically efficient, but has better than 100% electrical efficiency. In the case of a heat pump, measuring units of heat per Watt-hour is a bit like this in that some of the input energy (for the heat generation) has already been provided by a different process.