[Retric]

Toyota and Tesla don’t just manufacture and sell cars they have a more complicated business model. Tesla’s EV charging network for example should clearly be part of their valuation and is unrelated to Toyota’s business strategy.

IMO people are heavily discounting Toyota’s stock compared to their car/total sales for two reasons. Most critically their 200+ Billion dollars of debt, but also the significant sign of mismanagement from their useless investment in Hydrogen.

Hydrogen aircraft/heavy equipment could have real utility, but it’s simply not compelling for passenger vehicles. High capital and operating costs + low energy density + low efficiency all for faster fueling times.

[fomine3]

What tend to be missed is that Tesla's superior charger network is primary North America and part of Europe thing. Car market is bigger than them.

[phkahler]

EVs can be charged at home. Electricity is a commodity and will continue to be. I'm skeptical of the commercial value of their network long term.

[Retric]

People making along trips want to charge quickly and are willing to pay ~3x the retail cost of electricity to do so. So it can be quite profitable right now.

Longer term I expect charging to become a low margin commodity business, but other networks have had serious reliability issues so people may be willing to pay a premium simply to know everything will work when they get there.

PS: Even longer term I expect in road charging to become a thing on major highways, but that’s easily 20+ years away.

[_hypx]

This is delusional. Hydrogen is a fundamentally superior technology compared to BEVs. Tesla is the facing the next big crisis when the limitations of battery reveal itself. Batteries are simply not a sustainable technology. It is Tesla that is being disruption by innovation, not Toyota.

[martindbp]

Do you want to bet some money on that?

[BluePen7]

He's not wrong, but the world has picked a different path.

Hydrogen only creates water, and can be refuelled as quick as gas.

Wouldn't have minded driving one of those Toyota Mirais, but there isn't even a Hydrogen station at the other end of the long trip I regularly do, nor is it any cheaper than gas anyways.

And that's the story all over, better tech environmentally and practically but no infrastructure, no hype, and no momentum. It's dead.

[_hypx]

The world has not picked a path at all. We are currently still dependent on ICE cars. And the BEV era will come and pass without ever seriously challenging that dependency.