[bequanna]

> The level of violence here is just so much higher than other countries. Even living in San Francisco where the murder rate is half that of the US it is still double that of Europe and Canada.

The Bay Area is not representative of the rest of the US. Crime is out of control in SF proper and the Bay Area more generally due to reduced enforcement.

[laurencerowe]

The Bay Area is definitely not representative of the US as it is far safer overall. According to CDC Wonder for 2021 deaths from assault per 100k population were:

San Francisco County 4.9

California 6.3

USA 7.8

Santa Clara County is safer at 2.7 though I would really miss living in a walkable neighbourhood.

[bequanna]

> The Bay Area is definitely not representative of the US as it is far safer overall.

Cherry picking stats doesn’t make it true.

SF-proper is one of the worst urban areas in the US. Maybe only topped by Philly.

[121789]

That’s a bizarre statement. SF has ugly areas but still feels very safe. Would feel much more comfortable being dropped off in the worst places there vs Chicago, St Louis, LA, Miami, New Orleans, Atlanta and a bunch of other places

[selimthegrim]

I live in New Orleans and I have to say I feel safer there than San Francisco

[laurencerowe]

Downtown San Francisco can be unpleasant but you are more than 10x as likely to be killed in Orleans Parish (51.7 deaths by assault per 100k) than San Francisco County (4.9).

[bequanna]

How about Oakland at 2AM?

[121789]

Yes, Oakland is also on the list of the many cities that are more dangerous than SF

[laurencerowe]

I'm really not trying to cherry pick stats, death by assault / homicide is a pretty good indicator of levels of violent crime. SF-proper (i.e. San Francisco County) has a huge and highly visible homelessness problem and is definitely an outlier on that dimension. But while that is unpleasant it is less worrying than actual violence.

The US limits gun control so even in states like California that try to do something about it there are many more deaths than in countries which actually do something about it.