[zmgsabst]

I think it’s interesting you emphasized “losers”, and even chose that word at all.

What motivates you to disparage an entire group of people, because they (correctly, as you admit) point out that success doesn’t depend on the relevant talent but on socializing?

[ozim]

I point out that success requires talent - I don't know how you read that differently.

Most of the time losers claim that "if they would know the right people..." or point "he/she got a job only because they knew someone", well NO because knowing right people is only part of the work, one still needs to deliver and still needs to have relevant skills/talents.

[vineyardmike]

Knowing the wrong people doesn’t make you a loser. You should rethink your wording or qualify loser with “losing the chance to get hired at a certain place”.

Not knowing ozim and not getting hired at their company doesn’t make you a loser.

[volkk]

i dont think this person is stating that knowing the wrong people makes you a loser. it's that complaining about others getting jobs or opportunities centered around "they only got that because they knew someone" is generally a sentiment shared by losers. its a strong take, and i don't know if i agree/disagree, but there does seem to be a general trend of people who are always complaining about external forces are the ones that don't tend to ever gain any success or move up.

[codetrotter]

> there does seem to be a general trend of people who are always complaining about external forces are the ones that don't tend to ever gain any success or move up

This is true but on the flip side it also seems that some people who end up in privileged positions attribute 100% of success to themselves, and 0% to circumstances and external factors, which is just as bad

[volkk]

take this with a grain of salt, but i've listened to a lot of the "how i've built this" podcasts and i think 99% of the founders all believe that their success came with some level of luck. but then again, maybe thats just selection bias and the types that think they're god's gift to earth wouldnt be on the podcast to begin with

[ozim]

Yes - exactly that is what I mean in my way of thinking.

It is not about people who didn't get specific job but it is about people complaining. "Normal people" even if they don't get some job are not complaining like that.

[filoleg]

Knowing the "wrong people" (or not knowing the "right people") doesn't make one a loser. But discounting other people's skills just because they associated with the "right people" (in addition to having the skills) does.

[lliamander]

> Knowing the wrong people doesn’t make you a loser. You should rethink your wording or qualify loser with “losing the chance to get hired at a certain place”.

You are misreading ozim.

The claim is not that people without connections are losers. The claim is that people who often make the accusation of nepotism generally are losers.

In other words, untalented people will make the accusation of nepotism as ego defense to avoid confronting their own lack of skill.

[volkk]

its funny how mostly true this is if you take the converse. i have very rarely seen smart/successful people complain about others. they focus on themselves

[zmgsabst]

You’re calling people with the right skills/talent “losers” because they’re frustrated serendipity wasnt in their favor and they don’t also know the “right” people.

The people you’re disparaging know that skills/talent are also part of the work, but they’ve done that part — the part under their control. They’re commenting on the part of it which isn’t… and as far as I can tell, you’re disparaging them because you’re lucky and they aren’t.

[strawhatguy]

The 'loser' comment wasn't the best choice, true.

It's also interesting that you separated 'relevant talent' from 'socializing', as if socializing is ever not relevant. People do have to at least know about you, and that indeed is a skill on its own.

[rvba]

Looks like that person build their company on nepotism - and it hurts them. Thus the projection that others are "losers".