[fnordpiglet]

At the most charitable minimum that wasn’t the spirit of the convos internally though. These were the points of why aws didn’t think k8s was a great idea, even for customers, if they’re customers of aws rather than gcp. Aws makes money if you use them using k8s or ECS, and once you use any stateful service or spend the time to specify the eks infrastructure, you’ve got a switching cost no matter what.

My thought in this space is go with whatever is the least effort. There is no meaningful portability between cloud providers using anything right now. But if you don’t make your stuff baroque it’s also not hard to port between one provider and another from an infrastructure specification point of view. I think the “lock in” at the specification of infrastructure is a canard. Lock in happens to a much deeper level at the integrations between dependencies inside the customers own infrastructure and the stored state. Having 1000 services across an enterprise integrated inside (aws|gcp|azure|oracle|on prem) makes it hard to switch anywhere else from a basic connectivity, rights, identity, etc level - so hard that it degenerates into why “hybrid” cloud infrastructures basically fail. But that means switching is either all or nothing, which is impractical, or you bite off this integration problem, which is apparently impossible or at least absurdly hard. Then you’re also left with stored state, which is heavy and difficult to move, let alone expensive, but also the challenge of moving the state over with the state managing services without downtime or loss of data is also pretty hard. Hard enough that you can’t expect every team owning the 1000 services can do it.

So, you can pick k8s and run an abstraction on an abstraction, or not, but when it comes time to break your lockin, k8s won’t buy you anything.

[dilyevsky]

> There is no meaningful portability between cloud providers using anything right now

Where are you getting this from? If you use k8s as base layer, lift and shift your infra or even running multi-cloud is not much harder than bringing up new region on the same cloud

[fnordpiglet]

I’d refer you to the rest of what I wrote. If you have a single stack owned by a single team that has no meaningful use of the providers stateful services, yes. Otherwise, my points apply.