[loves_mangoes]

I had heard that there's a community of people who insufflate caffeine on Reddit, but this one is news to me.

Seems a little funny to go through all the trouble and extreme stigma of injecting yourself with an IV drug, only to pick ground up coffee beans as your poison of choice (!)

The study is interesting mostly for the fact that someone tried it, but ultimately the results don't show a very strong effect. I wouldn't put too much confidence in how well it would replicate either, these kind of studies can have a lot of variation.

>Every drug seems to have a “right” way to take it. You [...] booty bump ecstasy

That is not really typical. People normally eat it as ecstasy pills, or as MDMA powder.

Most recreational drugs can be taken rectally, that usually makes for a higher bio-availability and a faster peak plasma concentration. Some people do that a lot, with everything. It is not specific to ecstasy, that I know of.

[girvo]

Nearly any drug (modulo those that have very specific contraindications for it, like codeine) that can be taken rectally can be IVed too. Back when I was still an active heroin addict, I would IV MDMA if I was going out for the night. It’s incredibly intense, more intense than most other drugs when administered that way. bk-MDMA was superior to even MDMA itself when IVed, as well.

[nightowl_games]

Just chiming in to say: Holy shit and you've done well to still be alive. You've seen some shit.

[germinalphrase]

A paramedic friend advised that if you ever end up in the hospital in a lot of pain, always opt for the suppository.

[leetrout]

Reoccurring kidney stone sufferer here!

Belladonna and Opium (B&O) suppositories are one of the best things that I've discovered. They were very reluctant to write me a prescription for them but they were life changing last time I had to pass a stone. Dunno what would happen if I asked for one outright... when I tell them dilaudid doesn't do much for me I get treated very skeptically.

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT03332056

[freedomben]

> Dunno what would happen if I asked for one outright...

Nowadays unless you're over 65 you'd be labelled with "drug seeking behavior" (in your records) and sent home with nothing and a "come to the hospital when you pass your stone." Forget the fact that the difference between drug-seeking behavior and legitimately needing something stronger is indistinguishable, and forget the fact that it will cost thousands upon thousands of dollars for you to do it in hospital. Thank God they're keeping you safe from the evil Sacklers

[dec0dedab0de]

I had a staph infection on my balls when I was recovering from cancer. My normal doctor was busy so I went to urgent care, with blood dripping down my leg. It was the first time I ever asked for pain killers. I was prescribed acetaminophen.

I understand that addiction is a big problem, but this was a male doctor looking at a whole in my testicles, and telling me he can't give me painkillers

[leetrout]

I think that it universal of urgent care. If you need pain meds it has to be the ER or your PCP/GP in my experience.

[2devnull]

Do you have long hair or any other signs?

[dec0dedab0de]

I barely had any hair I was just a few months off chemo.

[btilly]

Absolutely.

My wife had some core muscles in her back collapse. Think unable to walk and could only crawl with me holding her hips up. When she went to the primary doc, he thought it was drug seeking behavior. When she went to the ER they luckily decided that she was serious and gave her the most powerful muscle relaxant available - Valium. She had no idea, but it it saved her life.

[alvarezbjm-hn]

I see several issues here, but I think it is extremely important that no one leaves thinking Valium is the most powerful muscle relaxant available. Valium is a centrally acting muscle relaxant, among others. It is very difficult to kill someone with an overdose, mostly interactions with other drugs.

The best muscle relaxant / antispasmodic depends on the patient and the situation. Valium is a safe indication from someone not dealing with those medications, as a temporary measure.

All benzodiazepines (including valium - diazepam) create dependence.

[btilly]

All I know is that that is what the ER doc told me, and it worked wonders.

[heliodor]

What does it mean for a muscle to collapse?

[btilly]

What I meant is that she had a serious muscle spasm which caused any attempt to use the muscle to leave her in agony. Since the muscle in question was in the lower back and is used for everything to do with balance, this left her bedridden.

It was extremely scary to go through.

[Gordonjcp]

American healthcare is a mess because of religious shit like this.

[petsfed]

Its interesting because its a very specific, recent, and almost uniquely American religious concept, that's written into virtually every aspect of our culture.

That is, it seems like nowhere else has the idea of purification through suffering really taken hold at such a widespread level for so long. I'd argue its because its just the flipside of the Prosperity Gospel. If you assume that one's physical conditions are a reflection of one's spiritual choices, then your first move when someone says "I'm in pain, please help me with my pain" is to ask "What have you done to deserve this pain? I won't remove God-given pain; if you deserve it, it would be a sin to do so", instead of "Here's something to make the pain manageable while we figure out how to remove the source of the pain".

[bnjms]

> I'd argue its because its just the flipside of the Prosperity Gospel.

I loathe the prosperity gospel too, and never miss a chance to blame its preachers where I can. But in this case I think glorification of suffering can’t be blamed on them because suffering was also fetishized by mother Teresa.

It does seem to be a uniquely American problem though.

[wpietri]

I agree it's terrible and very American, but I don't think it's recent. There's a good bit in this Backstory podcast where they talk about how part of the shift to sleeping straight through the night (as opposed to the previous behavior of first and second sleep) was partly driven by puritan busybodies (from the temperance movement, I think?) who thought that it was virtuous to sleep a bare minimum or less: https://backstoryradio.org/shows/on-the-clock-4/

And that of course goes back to the Puritans around at America's founding, who were deeply opposed to anybody having fun or enjoying themselves: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puritans#Behavioral_regulation...

I also recall reading of Calvinists who came to American in the mid-1800s to be free of such things as vaccines and insurance, because they thought those things interfered with God's plan. A plan, apparently, wherein a lot of people suffered while others stood around and quietly gloated that they were god's favorites.

[shigawire]

It's not religious - it's an overcorrection based on rampant over prescription of pain killers for years.

[matheusmoreira]

Yeah. This overcorrection happened in my country too. We saw what happened in the US and the result was doctors became more afraid of prescribing opioids even when in cases of acute pain where it's warranted. Fear of causing harm to patients due to risk of drug dependence.

And yet benzodiazepines are taken by vast amounts of people as if it was water.

[tempestn]

It might be both. An over-correction made more likely in part due to religious beliefs.

[refurb]

Huh? The country where you got Oxycotin for a headache only a decade ago doesn’t prescribe pain relief because of religion?

[stronglikedan]

Your friend isn't wrong. It's pretty much a direct blood vessel highway to the brain.

[polishdude20]

Hows that more direct than an injection?

[atomicnumber3]

Probably the ease and reliability of application.

Not everyone is easy to start an IV on, especially if it's hard for them to hold still (like if they're in so much pain that they're considering between IV drugs or a suppository).

[alvarezbjm-hn]

Venous drain doesn't go to the liver, first. Absorption is very regular. Works on unconscious patients.

Better that pills in every way, except convenience.

Injection is still better.

[atdrummond]

It isn’t - but if you’re a tough stick, it’s preferable to getting a central line or an IO shot.

[TurkishPoptart]

What's the reasoning? Instead of an IV? If I was in extreme pain, I would by default opt for an IV, which would be the fastest way to relieve it.

[germinalphrase]

I guess I misspoke a bit in the original comment. Yea - in the hospital, they’ll just inject if possible; however, if a doctor is writing a prescription and you’re offered pills vs a suppository, take the suppository.

[ses1984]

Was the footnote there when you wrote this comment?

>Most people consume ecstasy by mouth, but I’ve heard from many that anal ecstasy is a more satisfying experience.

I think the author was being a little facetious.

[polishdude20]

More like... fecetious

[rootusrootus]

You know what the root word of facetious is?

It's not, but it should be.

[pcthrowaway]

> I had heard that there's a community of people who insufflate caffeine on Reddit

I'm curious if it even absorbs well via the sinuses. From experience with powdered caffeine (mixing with shampoo as a folk treatment for hair loss), it doesn't readily dissolve at room temperature water, though of course it dissolves just fine in hot water, which is why the standard quick extraction from coffee beans involves hot water (cold brew by contrast, involves long periods of steeping for a result that still has less caffeine)

[jaggederest]

Caffeine is only "sparingly" soluble in water (as opposed to "freely" soluble in boiling water).

Chemists have wonderful words to quantify the exact degree of solubility under various conditions: "sparingly soluble" means it generally takes 30-100ml of solvent to dissolve 1g of the material in question.

So, if you're hip to the quantity of caffeine in your beans (by, perhaps, grinding and boiling 100g and then analytically extracting the mass of relatively pure caffeine with something like DCM, followed by recrystallization in water maybe), you can figure out how much caffeine will be present in your cold brew based on the quantity of solvent.

[reaperman]

> all the trouble and extreme stigma of injecting yourself

IM and subQ is surprisingly not much trouble, as long as you have a relatively pure dissolvable compound and safe solvent (various oils or bacteriostatic water) it takes like 2 minutes and $1.50 in supplies (a $0.25 syringe, two $0.25 needles, and a $1 PVDF/PETF 0.22um syringe filter). Not much more hassle than at-home insulin or TRT injections.

But definitely a huge stigma, and often the pharmacokinetics of IM/subQ administration aren't desirable for many drugs.

[fuzzfactor]

Snorting caffeine is one of the most comparable ways to realize that it's just as "safe" as cocaine.

[janderland]

What? You must be confounding route of administration with safety. Sure, oral administration is technically the safest because of first pass metabolism, but the choice of drug is a MUCH bigger safety factor. Snorting caffeine is much safer than snorting cocaine by every metric.

[fuzzfactor]

Milligram for milligram the pharmaceutical difference is mainly limited to the local anaesthetic effect not present in the caffeine.

Administration is just how you can figure it out for yourself at similar doses.

Go ahead and consume a gram or two of caffeine by any means and compare the stress on the heart and other organs, as well as personality.

Just because it's cheap, legal, and easily available doesn't mean it's safer by comparison.

Also since cocaine users generally consume recreational overdoses doesn't make either one any safer at any dose.

Plus think how many more addicts there are even at much less harmful doses.

Why do you think some of these hard-core caffeine addicts are injecting it anyway, plus handling it as well as they do. Definitely not recommended for anyone who hasn't already built up the tolerance addicts are known for.

Clean living pays off.

To go even more extreme, imagine if there were a nuclear war because somebody who was a little overly nervous pushed "the button".

What drug do you think would be detected if put to the test?

[timerol]

There's a footnote below on ecstasy

[_joel]

double bum drop