Hacker News new | ask | show | jobs
by explorer83 1107 days ago
So to my understanding what they are proposing is allowing you to be hacked by the government if you are a victim of hacking by another actor. I can see the value of this being able to access log files and other data that could assist in investigating the original hackers. I suppose they wouldn't want to always tip off the victim of hacking because the victim might change something that could scare aware the original hackers or delete useful metadata before the investigation could be carried out. But it essentially could become a free pass for the state to hack anybody. Because 1.) Anyone with a public facing server knows there are bot hacking attempts made against them 24/7 or 2.) Just hire a 3rd party to hack someone then you have immediate cause to get access to their data. This article didn't seem to have a definite answers what kind of protections would be put in place in these events. It sounded like they previously did try to word the law to only pertain to the original investigation but one can only wonder.
2 comments

> Just hire a 3rd party to hack someone then you have immediate cause to get access to their data.

This is absolutely what this is about.

Prosecuting cybercrime is a nightmare, especially if it crosses international borders. NL has historically had a bad CSA hosting reputation, though I get the impression LEO hands have been tied.

This legalizes fruit of the poisoned tree. Or at least, blurs the line until the fruit rolls into scope of plain-sight doctrine. Hire some Israelis to pop a machine and you won't have to deal with mapping Tor/VPN connections across all of the world's jurisdictions until it comes back to your own neighborhood.

The way it's phrased, they're positioned to take down entire networks of pedophiles. Compromise a host, then compromise anything connecting to it, etc.

It's ugly but makes a lot of sense, and there really isn't a better solution short of limiting networks to national borders. Anybody who leads a long enough wild goose chase across the world is more untouchable than Pedo Sandiego. This cuts through the shenanigans.

And unfortunately will be abused in time, but it solves the problems of today.

I have exactly zero faith that this will solve anything. It will allow them to round up some people, make a big fuzz about it in the press, and then the people they're chasing will simply adapt which is what always happens. Then, all that's left will be diminished rights for innocent people.
I agree, but look on the bright side-- you now know what to expect. They're being honest with you.

In the US, they'd do this stuff and make up an elaborate story about how they came to discover the evidence they illegally obtained.

Yes. This simply makes it legal for the Dutch government to hack their citizens. It doesn't matter what the intentions or purported rules are, if they are self-regulating then there are no limits. The publicly stated intentions and rules only give some naive people peace of mind.
Coming from the State that did not yet resolved one of the worst scandals ever...And from the Prime Minister that deleted official government data for years...

"Dutch scandal serves as a warning for Europe over risks of using algorithms" - https://www.politico.eu/article/dutch-scandal-serves-as-a-wa...

"Dutch PM has been deleting text messages daily for years: report" - https://nltimes.nl/2022/05/18/dutch-pm-deleting-text-message...

Don't overreact, they just kidnapped a few thousand kids from their families and placed them with foster parents due to some bureaucratic hick-ups. No biggy.

/s

That is not even the worst...The government resigned because of the scandal. The article below is a "sad face" of the prime minister at the time. I leave it as exercise for the curious reader a comparison with the current prime minister...

"Dutch government resigns over child benefits scandal" - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/15/dutch-governme...

its funny how when its "government" that does atrocities in the name of "government" and "democracy", its simply a "scandal", but if you or I stormed in and kidnapped the children of members of parliament, it would be a "viscious attack on democracy".

I wonder, at what point does a government become and enemy of the people, and defending oneself is legitimate? is it when the storm troopers comes to take your children based on false premises? if no, what is is then?

im sure a "scandalized government" will say that its "never", but really, when as criminals ever agreed that going against them is okay?

And the same government is in place they just switched some roles around. The PM is still the same.

  > kidnapped a few thousand kids from their families
What is this?
A sarcasm if you take into account "no biggy" part
And those fuckers are not in prison? And then they talk about "our democracy" and teaching other countries how to "respect human rights".
I get it. But I think there should be some limits. Otherwise they can do just about anything and walk away. Taking away children on a basis of pure speculation I think is plain and clear crime from which they should not be absolved.
True, and that has happened, of course. But luckily, immunity can also be revoked.