[ksec]

Not a popular opinion.

Current Apple and Swift felt somewhat like Apple and Dylan in the 90s.

May be time could tell. A lot of people hate Objective-C, and was cheering for Swift in 2014. Now nearly a decade later, it seems time and resources could have been spent somewhere else.

[pjmlp]

Not really, Dylan failed to ship on NewtonOS, Swift not only is shipping across all Apple platforms, it is replacing Objective-C.

Metal is the only green field framework that was still being built with Objective-C, and yet most just use the Swift bindings.

Maybe Swift isn't Objective-C without C, as originally announced, but something else isn't coming to replace it either.

[Grustaf]

What makes you say that? I don't think you can find many developers that would be willing to go back to Objective C.

[mpweiher]

Not sure why the only alternative to Swift is "going back", particularly when Swift is already going back in many ways.

How about going forward to an alternative that actually isn't a step back.

[Grustaf]

Swift is an amazing improvement over objective c and I don’t think there are any languages out there that are obviously superior for the use case.

The only people i ever hear complain are objc diehards and general apple haters.

[mpweiher]

Wrong on all counts.

I can't think of many use cases where Swift is actually better, though I do understand people believe it is. Why is...an interesting phenomenon.

In fact, it is difficult to conceive of a language less suited for the use cases Swift is touted for. See Swift playgrounds. See also: Mojo.

I think Objective-C seriously needs a replacement. Though it got a few fundamental ideas right, the details are almost all in dire need of improvement. Which is why it it is such a shame that the replacement is so unsuitable.

I really don't hate Apple. And my portfolio doesn't hate Apple either.

[Grustaf]

I’ve been using swift full time since 2014, before that i was using objective c full time.

I assure you that swift is a huge improvement for iOS and mac development, and the statistics shoe pretty clearly that this is also the consensus.

Some older developers might be wedded to objc because of old habit, but if you ask 100 developers that are new to apple platforms to choose between the languages, I’d be surprised if even 1 picked objective c.

It would of course be strange if a modern language, developed specifically for use on apple platforms and heavily supported on the framework side, would not be more suitable than an old fashioned language from the 80s.

Not sure what you mean by playgrounds, they are simply amazing and keep getting more powerful. And how does mojo even enter the discussion?

[pjmlp]

That will only happen by moving to another platform.