[pmeira]

I maintain a few niche (electric power systems) packages, and I wouldn't mind a one-time or yearly fee, or a fee per project created. I say this as a Brazilian who lived in the middle of nowhere and managed to have a website in the 90's as a teen. If a monetary fee is not desirable, some other hurdle/challenge would probably work fine.

Recently I've seen someone on Reddit trying to automate the creation of PyPI projects through GitHub Actions. The person was complaining that the first deployment couldn't use an API key for that project since it didn't exist. So I'm not surprised some people are trying to do the same for malicious purposes.

The PyPI front page lists 455k projects. If you search for "test", you'll see there's a lot of throwaway projects (note that test.pypi.org is a thing). I'm mostly an EE researcher and I'm not sure students need a low barrier to entry to PyPI, since pip and other tools support installing from GitHub without too much hassle and there are also other non-PyPI package indices. Student packages/projects tend to be abandoned soon after graduation. An archived repo (with a license...), on GitHub or somewhere else, sounds more reasonable and also has more visibility that could end in code reuse someday (through the service's own search and search engines in general). I'd love to understand why so many people repeat this meme that student and teens need trivial access to production infra like PyPI.

So, I'd say being too inclusive, allowing fully unrestricted trivial creation of projects is kinda foolish. There needs to be some extra step, be it a fee, identity confirmation, manual moderation/approval, or something else. I'm sure the PyPA devs/maintainers have ideas.

[ctoth]

> There needs to be some extra step, be it a fee, identity confirmation, manual moderation/approval, or something else. I'm sure the PyPA devs/maintainers have ideas.

When I was younger, I always thought computing was so incredibly cool, because me, just some blind kid in Florida, could contribute and make things and share things and just ...participate. I would talk to friends trying to go in to other careers, and excitedly talk about what I was working on and be curious why they never did anything related to what they wanted to do when they grew up.

Now, I understand how this comes about, bit by bit, with the best of intentions.

And I hate it.

Please, just no. If you want to set up a corporate only, super-sekret clubhouse of a PyPi that only the authorized developers can push to, well, the source code for PyPi is right here[0]! And here's Stripe[1]! But please don't break even more of the open, free Internet that I grew up with, I'm pleading with you.

[0]: https://github.com/pypi/warehouse

[1]: https://dashboard.stripe.com/register

[logdap]

The ones who broke the commons are the ones who abused it by uploading malware and lazy student projects. You shouldn't blame the host for trying to maintain standards in light of this. When you have a tragedy of the commons scenario, the solution is to regulate the commons. Otherwise it will lose all value for everybody.

[woodruffw]

> Recently I've seen someone on Reddit trying to automate the creation of PyPI projects through GitHub Actions. The person was complaining that the first deployment couldn't use an API key for that project since it didn't exist. So I'm not surprised some people are trying to do the same for malicious purposes.

Sorry for the tangent, but: you can do this now! If you use trusted publishing, you can register a "pending publisher" for a project that doesn't exist yet. When the trusted publisher (like GitHub Actions) is used, it'll create the project[1].

All of this is supported transparently by the official publishing action for GitHub Actions[2].

[1]: https://docs.pypi.org/trusted-publishers/creating-a-project-...

[2]: https://github.com/pypa/gh-action-pypi-publish

[pmeira]

Interesting, thanks for the links. By the way, the one I mentioned was in r/learnpython, which is probably not exactly the ideal audience for such a feature.

[woodruffw]

No problem. And I agree completely -- it'd be really nice if newcomers could copy a template (or even better, have a tool make one for them) that handles all of this behind the scenes.