[jerglingu]

Had a similar experience, but with the much more tame marijuana. It was a 6-hour long panic attack for me. Similar to the author of this, I read for years of how "the only way it could ever harm you is if you were crushed by 100 lbs of it" on sites like Reddit. It wasn't until after getting high that I heard about marijuana amplifying stress tendencies in a minority of people. I've always been high strung, and maybe my experience reveals something that needs fixing inside of me, but given how marijuana turned my anxiety up to a measure that has only ever been matched by an actual panic attack, I'll avoid LSD (and anything similar like shrooms) like it's a loaded gun pointed right at me.

[BossingAround]

> Similar to the author of this, I read for years of how "the only way it could ever harm you is if you were crushed by 100 lbs of it" on sites like Reddit

I think this is the direct result of just nonsensical criminalization that equated cannabis with drugs like heroin, while the toxicity of cannabis is much lower than alcohol, for example.

Legalization leads to better education, which typically provides both sides of the argument, so that a potential user can make educated decisions as to whether to try the drug or not. I have seen debates on "when not to use cannabis" on some canna podcasts (like Leafly, though I don't remember the episode).

I think that avoiding LSD for people prone to panic attacks is a pretty sound decision.

[TedDoesntTalk]

> Legalization leads to better education

It also leads to more cases of abuse. Like many things, legalization is both good and bad at the same time.

[miles]

>> Legalization leads to better education

> It also leads to more cases of abuse.

Citation needed. Here are a few counter reports:

Pointers From Portugal on Addiction and the Drug War[1]: "Opioid overdose deaths fell after Portugal’s policy change. So did new cases of diseases associated with injection drug use, such as hepatitis C and H.I.V."

Portugal’s radical drugs policy is working. Why hasn’t the world copied it?[2]: "Since it decriminalised all drugs in 2001, Portugal has seen dramatic drops in overdoses, HIV infection and drug-related crime"

How Europe’s heroin capital solved its overdose crisis[3]: "[T]he number of addicts was halved and overdose deaths had dropped to just 30 a year for the entire country. The number has remained steady ever since."

[1] https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/05/upshot/portugal-drug-lega...

[2] https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/dec/05/portugals-radic...

[3] https://www.cbc.ca/news2/interactives/portugal-heroin-decrim...

[yummypaint]

Raw data on health and habits of middle and highschool students in colorado can be accessed here https://cdphe.colorado.gov/hkcs

Cannabis was legalized there over a decade ago, and with that hindsight it's clear that legalization decreased consumption among minors.

[TedDoesntTalk]

Minimal google searching yields plenty of results. Here’s one for you:

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapsychiatry/article-abst...

“As Magdalena Cerdá, the study’s lead author, and her coauthors wrote in JAMA Psychiatry, “Although occasional marijuana use is not associated with substantial problems, long-term, heavy use is linked to psychological and physical health concerns, lower educational attainment, decline in social class, unemployment, and motor vehicle crashes.”

If you dont like that study, there are plenty of others. I’m not here to LMGTFY.

[javaunsafe2019]

I think it was asked for a study to back up the claim that legalization increases consumption

[de6u99er]

As someone who has been consuming lots of marijuana in the past 25 years, my recommendation is to not consume marijuana when in a bad mood or in stressful situations. I see drugs (including alcohol) as mood amplifiers.

[willio58]

This is a great way to use drugs. Even coffee! If you have coffee when you have anxiety you’ll be in store for much more anxiety

[notfed]

Also, THC triggers panic attacks in many people, regardless of their mood or whether any stress is going on in their life.

[BossingAround]

Many people do use cannabis for mood enhancement, though that a) might not work, and b) might lead to dependence.

[lazystar]

When folks say that marijuana's a safe drug, it's purely in reference to the fact that it wont kill you. 100 shots of tequila in an hour will cause death; 100 tokes of marijuana will not. The problem this results in is an interesting one: marijuana growers are constantly increasing the per gram density of THC/cannabinoids in their plants. The consequence of this is that today's marijuana, compared to that of the '70s, is like drinking Everclear vs. drinking a bud light. I've avoided using marijauna for a long long time now because of this; there's just no way to have a controlled slow buzz with marijuana.

[ksaj]

I guess because I live in a country where marijuana is fully legalized, I have never seen this as an issue. Our pot is labelled in the same way alcohol is, so you know pretty close to exactly what you are in for.

You can buy weed that has nearly no THC and a whole lot of CBD. But we also have infused pre-rolls that are nearly double the strength of natural weed with no CBD. These are polar opposite experiences.

Everything is labelled both in Percent, and in mg/g so there is no mistaking whether or not the weed is strong, weak, or somewhere in between.

Everything also gets described with terpene measures, as those volatile oils have a huge impact on the experience. It's pretty much the reason why if it smells super dank and thick, you're headed for couch lock, and if it smells lemony fresh and clean, you're in for a super clear head buzz instead.

Likewise, marijuana is nearly always sold with an educational fact sheet. One learns early on that CBD is both medically useful, but also takes "the edge" off of strong weed. Beginners should start slow, and don't smoke weed that has 0% CBD.

Also there's the well known strategy: If you're the personality that tends to have that dread feeling when the buzz comes on, then start with only a small amount until you pass that first stage. Then you can smoke like crazy without that dread feeling, since it is really only triggered in the initial phase. Once you're adjusted into it, you're all good for the night.

Just don't smoke so much that you end up greening out. That's a real thing, but nearly only ever happens if you eat too much THC edibles at one time. It's hard to green out from toking once you get past the initial phase because auto-titration kicks in big time. Most people don't even realize they are doing it, but it has everything to do with why one can toke 10x the amount over the course of an evening at a party than they ever could at home, and never have that dread feeling that one can experience if they use too much from the start.

People usually only learn that through experience, but it should be part of the education. Knowing the phases (initial coming on, the buzz, then fading back to normal) greatly enhances the experience.

[lazystar]

when you buy a pack of beer, you get 12 cans each with 12 ounces of liquid containing ~5% alcohol. you open a beer, you drink it.

when you buy a pack of weed, you get 1 blob of weed that the purchaser has to divvy up themselves, then has to find a container to consume it, prepare that container properly themselves (blunt, joint, bong, etc), then consume all at once due to the nature of the process. then theres sorting out all the indica/sativa blens. the point is, the system is stacked against newcomers.

edibles are the closest, thats correct - but sellers pack edibles with as much thc as possible. cutting edibles into pieces then further removes the users ability to control the experience, but at least its similar to a pitcher of beer.

[ksaj]

No, you can buy it that way. But you can also buy them pre-rolled just like cigarettes. There are also so many other forms - pills, lozenges, breath strips, etc. The THC infused beverages are gauged in the same way beer is - a light beverage will have about the same impact as a light beer, a standard beverage will have about the same impact as a standard beer, and strong... you get the idea. We actually don't have strong THC beverages, but if we did, you know exactly what it would be comparable to in terms of strength.

My partner doesn't like getting too buzzed, so I always get gummies that are about 1/3 the strength of normal gummies. And normal gummies aren't that strong. You can buy them super strong, but that's a conscious choice that again is reflected on the package and labelling. You never have to cut your edibles. You just buy the strength you want.

Incidentally, whether it is indica or sativa is in the small print here. The typical effects are listed on the vendor web pages.

The problems you list were certainly true as recently as 2 or 3 years ago, and pretty much limited to the illegal or grey markets. Legalization has taken it a whole lot further ahead.

They are professionally produced and controlled products these days.

PS: You can even buy cannabis products with nearly no THC in them. They are high in CBD, specifically for medical use since they are not psychoactive. Apparently CBD gummies are used by a lot of people for insomnia, because it is indeed relaxing, with no high feelings whatsoever. Much better than most OTC sleeping pills for that reason.

So literally everything you said is based on purchasing from the streets or grey market, and not professional or controlled outlets. The range of what's available is huge, and everything is clearly labelled so you won't be making any more mistake than you would overdrinking that 6 pack example you mentioned.

[lazystar]

> everything is clearly labelled

heh. sounds like youve never been in a weed store. everything is behind the counter - its not like a supermarket beer aisle where you can pick and choose at your leisure before making your way to the checkout aisle. all the clerks are stoned, and if youre the only one in the store, theyre all looking at you. its one of the most surreal experiences you will ever encounter.

[ksaj]

I only order online. We even have same-day shipping for most places. But I'm always fully stocked up, so I am more patient about it. My source of choice is a few provinces away, so I just use regular mail.

The stores do tend to suck, so I lost interest in them a very long time ago. The ones I've been in are just nicer/cleaner than the grey market stores that came before legalization. I occasionally drop by one if I happen to be passing by, and I even found an "upscale" shop. But still not my thing. I don't like shopping in stores anyway, and they tend to be gloomy and miserable for such a fun product. I'm really not into the Bob Marley Rah Rah Rah thing, either. I don't feel that compulsion to have pot leaves on everything I own, wave flags, or have white-guy imitation dreadlocks.

So no, I have absolutely been there, and yup I totally agree with you on the store details. But you keep picking the negative things that are easy to avoid. Stay away from such places, and go for more professional vendors.

If you want modern weed with full factual information backing it, you have to buy in a modern way. Preferably from a vendor that also fills medicinal prescriptions, since they are the ones that know what they are talking about, and aren't stuck in the decades old Cheech and Chong era.

[creatonez]

Vape pens are fairly predictable, you can have a known potency dose in the cartridge and each puff will be a predictable potency.

Anyways, vapes are great for nicotine and DMT but I'm not a fan of how most cannabis vape pens get easily gummed up. So I'd rather stick to dab rigs and bongs.

The problem with edibles is that the digestive system's metabolism produces way more psychedelic cannabinoids. It's a different experience, one that can be more anxiety inducing in lower doses.

[lazystar]

> The problem with edibles is that the digestive system's metabolism produces way more psychedelic cannabinoids.

there is a multi-billion dollar market just waiting for the first person that creates a strain of weed that is resistent to this effect.

[connicpu]

This is one area where I think legalization has helped. In my state, I can now get an inhaler using the same basic tech as asthma inhalers, and it can fairly precisely dose 2.5mg of THC per activation. Added benefit, completely smokeless. Even vape pens cause me to cough pretty bad (let alone actual smoking), so it's a huge upgrade to the experience.

[sitkack]

The thc/gram is higher, but you can easily control intake with edibles. It is easy to still get low quality shake weed, like the stuff our parents smoked in the 70s, you just have to go to the weed shops in the poorer parts of town and tell them you are making brownies. I can get an ounce of crap weed in Seattle for 30-40. Perfect for cookies or brownies.

[aardvarkr]

I think your fear is stopping you from experimenting with MJ. Just like how you can dose with alcohol or any other substance regardless of how concentrated, you can take a smaller, more measured dose of MJ instead of finishing an entire joint by yourself. Edibles and cartridges are great ways to dose.

[logi2mus]

Also Nocebo effect!

[kstenerud]

I had a really bad experience with marijuana. I'd tried it a few times before, but it always had literally zero effect on me (as in I smoked as much as everyone else, they got baked and I felt nothing). And then one day I took a single hit in a shop in Vancouver and was almost instantly hit with brain zaps. It got so bad that I couldn't walk without throwing up, had trouble seeing, and this lasted for hours (from 10:30 am until a little past midnight when it finally subsided enough to sleep). Never again.

[nvarsj]

It's colloquially called a "whitey". Likely you had a very high THC strain and it hit your body like a truck of bricks because you weren't accustomed to it.

[klyrs]

By any chance was this "one hit" done on a hot knife at the Pain Management Society on commercial drive pre-legalization? Because I've heard a similar story from quite a few people, several of them heavy users. No warning, and sent on their merry way without checking if they had a safe way to get home. Which I mention because getting lost trying to find home is a common theme in their stories. The people who knew what they were looking at report the dose as a generous dollop on the order of .5g.

[kstenerud]

Not on Commercial... it was downtown somewhere I think (this was 8 years ago and the day is a blur). There was a kinda grungy store downstairs that also sold grey-area mushrooms, and a "bar" upstairs. I remember the proprietor saying that they operated it as a "protest" against cannabis laws. They had these machines that instantly vaporize the stuff.

[klyrs]

Different location, same delivery. It was a bit of a wild west before legalization. You had in one hit what most heavy users would consider plenty for a binge weekend. I'm glad to see those old shops go.

[legohead]

First time I tried it, I didn't know what I was doing, and smoked half a joint. I figured it was like cigarettes - you're supposed to smoke the whole thing, but I had some presence of mind to just try half.

That night I was basically paralyzed. It wasn't a bad experience, but I was not ready for it to be that powerful.

Since then I've just being using gummies. You can dose 5mg or 10mg which is plenty for me to just have a good feeling and still fully function. I've also noticed that different strands affect me way different. I may become sleepy, or really happy and giddy, or totally calm and cool, or motivated, or just a nice elated feeling, or combinations of those and more.

There's the whole sativa/indica thing, but I feel like the market just guesses what their strand is because 1) The feelings are still super random within the same type and 2) There are way too many types of "feelings" to just binary classify with.

[MathMonkeyMan]

> I've always been high strung, and maybe my experience reveals something that needs fixing inside of me, but given how marijuana turned my anxiety up to a measure that has only ever been matched by an actual panic attack, I'll avoid LSD (and anything similar like shrooms) like it's a loaded gun pointed right at me.

I'm the same way, perhaps to a lesser degree. My sister more so.

Part of me thinks I need to get really high more often and explore myself, but there's a chance I'm just chasing shadows and another approach is needed.

Lots of people have an "always sober" policy and they do fine. Or are they square?

[JeremyNT]

I had this buying some weed derivative edibles (marketed as delta 8) in a state with full on prohibition.

I've smoked weed, I've had edibles (both homemade and from fully legal dispensaries), and at most got kind of spaced out and overly talkative. Whatever this stuff really was, it presented as a wholly different experience; strong hallucinations, time felt like it was slowing, inability to focus, loss of motor control (like unable to get down a flight of stairs), even unable to operate my phone enough to send a text message. Ultimately it led to panic and fear; I was completely unprepared and basically incapacitated until the next day. It ranks as one of the worst experiences in my life, and it felt as if it would never end.

There's a wide range of experience possible from this stuff, even things that (should you believe the internet) are as harmless as weed.

After this, I feel like I'm done for good. Whatever nebulous and unproven benefits that might possibly exist don't seem to be worth the very real risks (that I now am aware of first hand).

[folbec]

Reading the various comments on this article, I get the feeling that drugs are russian roulette with a random number of bullets in the barrel.

Some people enjoy that. Not me.

[throwaway173738]

As someone for whom Marijuana also induces panic and anxiety I second this. At least when I dropped acid I could somewhat control the dosage and was careful not to start with a full dose.

I actually like acid but I wouldn’t call it safe. The visual effects can be quite intense and if you’re not used to the idea that reality is influenced by perception you’re in for a really bad time.

[verteu]

Sounds rough -- how'd you administer & what was the approximate dose?