[Brushfire]

"I have been told there was no direct tax in US till 1913, so how did it work then? "

This is not entirely true. There was an income tax that was put into place for a number of years around the civil war, but was later abolished. Im not certain on the exact years, though.

Either way, taxes still abounded back then, they just werent compulsory. But they were if you were alive, eating, and tried to move around society. In other words, if you lived in BFE and had a farm, you probably didnt pay anything -- but if you lived in the city, you almost had to when buying tea, other food items, paying for stamps, other imported items.

The debate about whether we should have income tax or not is somewhat moot outside of armed rebellion. Its here to stay. The point that is more important is that it should be uniform, easy to follow, and LOW. I should not pay 50% of my efforts to the government. 5%, ok, 10% maybe, but 50%? no. The amount is what makes the income tax so unbearable, not that it exists at all.

Brian

[APLonDrugs]

“The debate about whether we should have income tax or not is somewhat moot outside of armed rebellion” I hope this is not true, I’d prefer a peaceful solution. I believe all things are possible, perhaps it is not possible because people think it is not. Even if you want it low, the best strategy may be to urge for abolishment, and the chances of getting low taxes go up. I was for low taxes, now I’m for abolishment. The more I learn about the system being rigged, the more I want it absolutely.

[krschultz]

Manhattan is a tax shelter? You certainly don't know much about Manhattan.

There were taxes prior to the income tax, they were just different taxes. A flat rate sales tax and no income tax would still be tax - it would just be easier to avoid.

[APLonDrugs]

"It does not surprise anyone when I tell them that the most important tax haven in the world is an island," international tax expert Marshall Langer pointed out in a speech last November. "They are surprised, however, when I tell them that the name of the island is Manhattan."

By OECD standards, we are the largest tax haven in the world. The United States, for example, source: https://www.reason.com/news/show/34248.html

the power to avoid, adds to freedom, not suggest with 19,000 pages of tax code though....

[krschultz]

Ah I wasn't thinking of non-citizens, for me it is hard to think of it as a shelter when I pay significantly more tax now that I work in Manhattan than when I worked in New Jersey.