[benatkin]

> uninformed attack on homeschooling in general

You can probably tell I have direct experience with it, yet you call me "uninformed". It's a pretty common tactic when defending a fringe group.

However, I brought information into it. There's no mention in your comment about the reference I provided. Gee I wonder why.

[lolinder]

I did reference your data, I just don't find it to mean what you think it means. It shows that plenty of people (68%) choose to homeschool at least in part because of "dissatisfaction with academic instruction at other schools". That those people are also worried about peer pressure doesn't make them intellectually incurious.

For a bit more nuance, see this report [0]:

> This exploratory study examines the academic outcomes of homeschooled students who enter a medium size doctoral institution located in the Midwest. Descriptive analysis reveals homeschool students possess higher ACT scores, grade point averages (GPAs) and graduation rates when compared to traditionally-educated students. In addition, multiple regression analysis results reveal that students who are homeschooled earn higher first-year and fourth-year GPAs when controlling for demographic, pre-college, engagement, and first-term academic factors.

And this one [1]:

> Consistent with the findings on socialization of homeschooling youngsters and the social and civic engagement of their parents (Lines 2000a), available research finds that homeschooled adults also participate in community-based activities at rates much higher than those found in the general population (Ray 2005). Two studies in particular open a window on this issue. In the mid-1990s, Knowles and Muchmore (1995) reported that homeschooled adults were not disengaged socially or civically. In a comprehensive analysis of the issue a decade later, Ray (2004a) documented that homeschooled adults were indeed heavily involved in community life at the local and national levels and were more civically involved than the general population of adults. He found that compared to public school graduates, homeschooled adults were more likely to (1) vote; (2) be involved in ongoing community service; (3) be part of an organization; (4) write, telephone, or sign petitions; and (5) participate in a protest or boycott.

I'm not cherry-picking here, I'm literally just going down the list of results for this Google Scholar search [3].

[0] https://files.eric.ed.gov/fulltext/EJ893891.pdf

[1] https://www.educacaodomiciliar.fe.unicamp.br/sites/www.educa...

[3]. https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C45&q=col...

[benatkin]

Hmm, so you did mention my data, but didn't acknowledge that I must at least be somewhat informed.

I don't think fringe is a pejorative.

---

Yes, finding issue with the schools is part of the response. However, complaining about the schools is not a great victory for those arguing for homeschooling. They would have to provide a superior alternative. And there isn't overwhelming evidence that either is better, because there are so many variables. And a good study would try to control for them, so it is good that the one you mentioned did.

Everybody knows schools have problems and many try to solve them or have their children go to other schools.

When parents say their kid can't possibly go to any school that has other kids in it, though in some cases, it is a bit like Munchausen's syndrome where the parent invents a problem wants to step in and be the hero. And that is difficult for a lot of children to handle.

[lolinder]

To the extent that your original comment related to OP's post at all, you were insinuating that intellectually curious homeschoolers don't exist. Your own data disproves that, as does the data I provided in my follow-up.

I'm sorry that you had the displeasure of interacting with badly-homeschooled people. I've had the same displeasure of interacting with badly-public-schooled people, so I sympathize. If I were you, though, I would look at the statistical outcomes before making sweeping generalizations about an entire class of family.

[benatkin]

> To the extent that your original comment related to OP's post at all, you were insinuating that intellectually curious homeschoolers don't exist. Your own data disproves that, as does the data I provided in my follow-up.

No I wasn't insinuating that intellectually curious homeschoolers don't exist.

I suggested that those in it for that reason aren't the most common and wondered where OP found people who were homeschooling out of lifestyle design and not protectiveness. Protectiveness is the most common reason. They didn't have an answer for me apparently, but I was genuinely hoping for one. I in fact know some homeschool for lifestyle design. I'm very curious about those who traveled or helped their children get their 10,000 hours in something like writing or playing a musical instrument (hell, even programming).

I'm pretty sure mine was among the better homeschooled people, at least out of those homeschooled out of protectiveness (as the original aim, the original reason for homeschooling often gets lost in the noise). The truth is that there is something missing even with the best homeschooled people.