[toast0]

> If you work for a company like Amazon, and you don't want to be laid off, the only thing you can do to move the needle is join a union.

If you don't like how one party can make changes to your job without your meaningful input, you should throw in so two parties can make changes to your job without your meaningful input? Also, you should be sure to pay some part of your wages to the second party, even if you don't like what they're up to.

[pnt12]

That's a very one sided opinion: more complexity is necessarily bad, no matter anything else.

I'm not particularly pr-union but I'd argue for another dimension: to the company, you're an employee, but to the union you're a customer.

If too many people dislike an union, it can dissolve. If too many people dislike a company, things aren't as simple, because they depend on their wages (and in the USA: insurance) to live.

[toast0]

> That's a very one sided opinion: more complexity is necessarily bad, no matter anything else.

I think that's a fair summary of my worldview. I don't like unnecessary complexity in most of my life, and adding an intermediary to an important relationship needs to get over a high hurdle for me to consider it's necessary.

Maybe if there's an example of software development under a union shop that you can point at and say this particular Union improved working conditions for people like me in this particular way, I can say hmmm, maybe that's worth the added complexity. But most of what I've seen from unions is that they add a significant chance of not being able to work because of disagreements between the union and the employer or solidarity in disagreements between other unions and other employers; as well as most often salary rules that are based on time at the job rather than quality of work. Quality of work is hard to measure, but I've been generally happy with the results of that measurement.

Maybe the model of talent unions rather than blue-collar unions is a more appropriate model, but I'm not sure how that works. Do I need to give union dues and hire an agent, too?

[harimau777]

What's your alternative?

[toast0]

In the tech industry? Do your best to find a company you can stand working for. If you can't, find a way to work for yourself.

You may not be able to work on the same problems when you work for yourself, or at a company you can stand working for. But there are lots of things you can do in tech as a company of one. This is in contrast to a lot of industries; you can't meaningfully mine for minerals, or build cars or even car parts as a company of one; although there certainly are artisanal car builders, and small auto repair shops.