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by starkd 1183 days ago
This is a more complex than that. I don't like the invasion, but its not like Russia has no vital interests in the area that is right on their border. And they have occupied Crimea in the past going back to 1776. I'm just saying they have as much national interest as the West does. Israel Prime Minister claims they had a deal that was agreed to but Biden administration turned it down.

It's also the responsible thing to do to look at the prospects of forcing a war though, when the Urkainians are so heavily outgunned. 200,000 Ukrainians have died in this fight. Maybe 50,000 Russians have died (its hard to find out specifics). The US wants to fight this war on the cheap with the Ukrainians taking all the casualties so that Americans won't have to. That is pretty deplorable to me.
3 comments
CamperBob2 1183 days ago
Your casualty figures don't seem to line up with most other sources. Any citations?
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starkd 1183 days ago
The sources are all over the place, but they all seem to be horrific. There are estimates that Ukrainian deaths so far could be anywhere from 100K to 200K.

Russians have lost a lot too. But the only thing we know is that they are depressingly high.

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SideburnsOfDoom 1183 days ago
> The sources are all over the place

You gave specific figures. From which source, and why choose that one?

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schuyler2d 1182 days ago
What about Ukraine's national interest? Where does that fit in?

What about the Eastern European countries' interests whose combined economies eclipses Russia?

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luckylion 1183 days ago
Of course Russia has vital interests all around it: everyone does. But it doesn't follow that "therefore Russia should be allowed to annex everything around it".

Again, we know that playbook, it has played out before in Europe. Today it's Ukraine, tomorrow it's Poland, and your arguments will still be exactly the same: Russia has vital interests in Poland, Russia has occupied Poland before, Poland is outgunned, and why would we care about Poland, really?

And then it's Germany, at which point, again, nothing has changed. Britain and France might use their nuclear deterrence when it's their turn, but if they listened to you, they'd probably say "do we want to end humanity just because we don't like Russia to rule over us? Surely not, humanity is too important to be destroyed over Russia's vital interest to annex whatever is next to Russia" and roll over.

It would end only when Russia invades the US or China, because neither will allow it if their nuclear weapons are still available by then.

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