[unxdfa]

Yep. I’m in the middle of switching from macOS back to windows because I need to do things I can’t do on macOS. I’ve had to build out a locked down windows 10 LTSC build to get anywhere near a sensible outcome for me.

I think we should start a revolt in the IT sector against this shit really. I’d start one but I don’t know where to begin.

[jeffparsons]

> I think we should start a revolt in the IT sector against this shit really. I’d start one but I don’t know where to begin.

Personally, or at work? Personally, the first steps are actually pretty easy: install an operating system that doesn't do this stuff. And then deal with the fallout as best you can without going back — e.g. finding replacements for software that only ran on $OTHER_OS. Source: did it decades ago. No regrets.

At work? Good luck. We have no credible professional bodies that enough workers are involved in for them to have much relevance, and employers that actually have any kind of values relevant to this discussion are vanishingly rare.

I think the most productive thing would be to start conversations about ethical choices in the computing professions. Start local (friends, colleagues, local meet-ups). Find existing groups with similar values, and share experiences. Then _federate_. Set up regular inter-group meet-ups. Over time, formalise a union out of the federation.

Edit: oh, and don't be an extremist. Keep your policies lean and well within the Overton window. Pick your battles carefully. Compromise isn't weakness — it's just realistic. As long as you're moving things in the right direction, it's still good.

[unxdfa]

I’d more expect the revolt to be along the lines of calling Microsoft out for being a dick. More an intervention than a revolt.

[froggit]

> I’d more expect the revolt to be along the lines of calling Microsoft out for being a dick. More an intervention than a revolt.

To Microsoft, that isn't considered to be a revolt or an intervention. When receiving consumer input of such a nature, the preferred terminology is "Positive user experience report."

[AnthonyMouse]

Start here:

> because I need to do things I can’t do on macOS.

IT departments in huge corporations have purchasing requirements specs. Require any software that you pay money for to run on at least one non-Microsoft operating system. As a second source requirement.

If more than a trivial number of large corporations do this, developers make sure their software runs on other systems, which is what allows users to switch. Large IT departments are in a position to actually move the needle here.

This also has the side benefit of being a heuristic that excludes primarily low-quality software, because most higher-quality software is already portable.

[8ytecoder]

I work for a pretty large financial corporation. They sent out the IT roadmap for the next year and in it was casually mentioned that they expect Macs to be the dominant platform in the next five years. Our current mac usage is <15% and as a result support is an afterthought with a very frustrating experience. For them to say that and push for this change in an industry that very strongly favours Windows is the clearest indication I’ve seen that Windows is starting to lose.

[concinds]

macOS now has 30% market share in the US. Surprised me.

https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/united-st...

[CamperBob2]

Wow, I had no idea. Never mind Nadella, why does Microsoft's board of directors tolerate this?!

[unxdfa]

Windows doesn't matter to Microsoft now. The big sellers are Azure and Office 365 and they work on Macs.

As for market share in the US, I very much doubt it's that high really. There are huge unimaginable swathes of windows boxes which won't show up in GlobalStats at all. I know a company with 50,000 desktops that can only visit a web site on an internal network for example. Those sorts of installations are everywhere.

[happymellon]

But this is a terrible attitude to have.

I already see this situation with Google, where non-technical folks will push back on choosing Google products even if they are the only credible player because of the perception that Google cancels everything and they don't want to be caught out.

Microsoft is playing with fire if they think that screwing with their customers computers will have no repercussions with other products.

[thrwawy74]

They've build up enough political capital to expend it, upset their customers, and normalize all these dark patterns. They're taking the risk that 5 years later everyone will consider these things common and not be bothered by them. Apple did the same thing by making an attractive ecosystem. Windows is using its dominance as a platform to make the same exchange.

[TheRealDunkirk]

And this includes company computers. Imagine if commercial "seats" were factored out, in order to show how actual people are voting with their wallets.

[justsomehnguy]

macOS now has 30% market share in the US Internet

[unxdfa]

Fintech here. Also large. We have no Macs. We will probably never have any. We have a lot of software which will most likely never work on them. None of our clients have them as well.

Also another company we are related to tried a roll out and found they couldn't get Apple to deliver anything other than crap off the shelf configs in any quantity. Dell could. So the trial was ended.

[unxdfa]

No one does this or cares. They care about delivery and keeping ROI high and costs down, not demanding platforms.

I wouldn't draw any assumption that higher quality software is portable. I've seen monocultural genius (Keysight Genesys) and cross platform garbage (libreoffice) for example.

[binkHN]

> I’ve had to build out a locked down windows 10 LTSC build to get anywhere near a sensible outcome for me.

Smart move. Truly sucks that we have to do this nowadays, but this is what Microsoft has become. Back in the day I would format a machine I purchased from a vendor due to all the added garbage; Microsoft is becoming just as bad.

[specialist]

Any chance ReactOS (the FOSS clone of Windows) can fill in?

Or maybe use VirtualBox or VMware?

[xigoi]

Quite an unfortunate name. It sounds like the operating system is built using React.js, to which any sane person will go “nope”.

[unxdfa]

I would really love ReactOS to replace windows. Genuinely would. But it's not there yet. I've tracked their development for years.

As for VirtualBox and VMware, that means I have two operating systems instead of one :(