[gamblor956]

When I was a public defender representing the mentally disordered, literally all of my clients' mental disorders had been triggered by marijuana use. Cannabis (along with other psychoactive substances) is known to trigger latent mental disorders (like schizophrenia, etc.). This is one of the justifications given for continuing to keep it illegal at the federal level.

This doesn't mean that marijuana causes mental disorders; it only triggers latent disorders, meaning those already present in the brain due to genetics, environment, or brain damage (caused by concussions, drug use, etc.).

Other psychoactive substances (especially meth) can actually cause mental disorders due to the structural brain damage they inflict.

[notch898a]

It's my understanding in some jurisdiction claiming a drug nexus makes you eligible for certain more attractive sentences or diversions, such as going to a treatment facility in lieu of jail.

Could it be that some of your clients would have, say, benefitted from claiming a drug triggered nexus to take advantage of this?

[gamblor956]

No, the meme of "drug nexus" being a "get out of jail" card is just an internet meme. It only applies to drug possession or drug use cases (like intoxication). It doesn't apply to crimes where drug use is irrelevant to the charges (such as larceny), or a lesser charge (such as compared to assault,, etc.)

For most of my clients, the cases were about whether they had mental disorders. And the consequence of being deemed to have a mental disorder that caused them to offend was involuntary commitment to a mental hospital for at least as long as their original prison sentence (and for violent offenders, theoretically for the rest of their lives).

[notch898a]

Ah damn. Is RDAP just a scam? I had thought for instance non-violent federal crimes are often eligible for reduced time, often even if they weren't drug crimes. (you're only eligible for this program if you had substance use)

  Federal law allows the BOP to reduce the sentences of non-violent offenders who complete the RDAP program by up to one year. The RDAP program is voluntary and takes 500-hours, nine- to twelve-months to complete. The RDAP is authorized by 18 U.S.C. § 3621, which directs the Bureau of Prisons (BOP) to provide residential substance abuse treatment for all eligible federal inmates.

Guessing the feds just lie and don't actually take the time off then?.

>only applies to drug possession or drug use cases

Yeah but these are pretty common charges no? Seems relevant. For instance, my understanding is in some instances if you have a drug disorder with possession you're in a better position than merely found in possession and don't even use drugs (or use them without having a "disorder"), as the drug-nexus'd disorder might make you eligible for some programs.

I gotta say I didn't realize these programs were just memes, must be a lot of attorneys lying to their clients.

[gamblor956]

In theory RDAP is open to all (federal) offenders. In practice, only those with drug-related offenses make it into the program, and the wait list is years-long and most eligible inmates complete their sentence before their spot on the wait list comes up. The reduction of sentence is applied against the drug-related sentence. The prisoner is moved to a halfway house up to 1-year before the original expiration of their sentence, and can be returned to prison for violating the rules of their transitional release.

Yeah but these are pretty common charges no? Seems relevant. For instance, my understanding is in some instances if you have a drug disorder with possession you're in a better position than merely found in possession and don't even use drugs (or use them without having a "disorder")

Yes, they're quite common. But pure drug offenses (other than dealing) generally get sent straight to diversion if they qualify (and space is available). Most drug offenses in addition to other crimes and this generally makes the defendant ineligible for diversion. Given two similar defendants whose only difference is that one is substance dependent and the other is not, the dependent defendant will never get a meaningfully shorter sentence than the defendant who is not and is more likely to end up with additional restrictions on their parole that make it easier to send them back to prison.

must be a lot of attorneys lying to their clients.

The programs are not memes, but your understanding of them, and how they are actually discussed by attorneys with their clients, appears to be based on internet memes of these programs.

[notch898a]

So not only do you now acknowledge you were lying about these programs (not) existing for non-drug offenses, now you're expecting me to take on your (shot) credibility that only drug-related offenses make it into the program. This is WRONG as evidenced by BOP's report which shows significant underlying offenses for RDAP participants in fraud, immigration, firearms, and "other" offenses.

https://www.ussc.gov/sites/default/files/pdf/research-and-pu...

>he dependent defendant will never get a meaningfully shorter sentence

Up until the BOP report showed to me you were lying about the programs, I probably would have take your word on this. Now I'm not so sure. Would be interested in seeing the evidence that this never happens.

I have no idea what you're talking about regarding me operating off of "memes." They may exist, but they're not something I've looked for nor noticed.

[gamblor956]

I can see that reading comprehension is hard for you.

The programs you describe are not an alternative to prison for drug users convicted of non-drug offenses, which is what your original comment claims. And you keep harping on the FDAP program, which is a federal program for those convicted of federal crimes, not state level crimes, and which provides for substance abuse counseling within federal penitentiaries.

And I notice you deliberately avoid mentioning that your study was based on data collected from 2002-2010.

What's next? Are you also going to claim that Blackberry dominates smartphone sales, based on 13-21 year old data?