[orcajerk]

Last time I went to the doctor, he charged me $300 to google symptoms on a computer. Now you're saying I get to pay $300 for him to ask ChatGPT? No thanks. We all know that is where this is going - doctor decision support system, i.e. the AI has access to information locked behind expensive journals that the patient does not.

[matsemann]

Last time I asked a developer to fix a bug, he charged me $300 to google the api docs..!

But this isn't even about the doctor asking GPT, this is transcribing the video call so the journaling becomes easier and the doctor can spend more time with their patients. A good thing, no?

[CuriouslyC]

Doctors are liability lightning rods who've gone through a professional hazing process to join an exclusive club that has massively warped American medicine through its lobbying efforts. Unless you're dealing with a specialist they're often not super competent - that's why doctors are being replaced with nurse practitioners and physicians assistants everywhere (to the point that you often won't ever see an actual doctor at a lot of medical facilities) and usually people are completely oblivious to the fact.

Pharmacists in other countries do a lot of the basic shit doctors in the USA do, with less overhead, for cheaper and with a much faster turnaround. Antibiotics, blood pressure/cholesterol meds, antidepressants and other rubber stamp drugs absolutely do not need to be strongly controlled.

[YeGoblynQueenne]

Antibiotics don't need to be strongly controlled?!

[soco]

No. The transcription part is done by Whisper. After that, GPT summarizes a clinical note which may be truthful - or may have hallucinations just as well.

[sharemywin]

I'll be happy to do that for like $200 as long as I can use ChatGPT

[avgDev]

If my doctor is googling he is doing his job.

He has medical knowledge which allows him to sort through information.

Any developer who doesn't google today is hindering his ability to develop and slowing the development process. Just like the dev cannot hold all the algorithms and language caveats/syntax in his head, a physician cannot hold all the information in his brain. He may not be familiar with symptoms or might be googling to see if there is anything "new" as pertaining to a patients specific issue.

There was a time steroid injections were the go to for tendon injuries, recently science came out that it results in worse long term outcomes and PT should be the first line treatment.

[CuriouslyC]

I would find it suspect if my specialist was googling unless I had something really weird going on, and might consider going to a different specialist.

[ceejayoz]

If they're a neurologist and Googling "what does brain do", sure.

If they're searching up safety data on a slightly-over-recommended dose for a particular medication (like, say, a gastric bypass patient who takes an oral med that's not absorbed as much as in a person with a normal stomach), I'd much prefer they be certain than guess.

[SkyPuncher]

I still routinely Google some things that "I should know" when doing software development. Despite being already correct 99% of the time, an internet search helps with two things:

* Presenting potentially new information or methods of doing something. My "old" knowledge might still be correct, but a "new" method may have optimizations or benefits.

* Even though, I'm already 99% correct, it's not worth the hassle of being wrong the 1% of the time - especially when the solution is 20 seconds of internet search.

[Shared404]

> Last time I went to the doctor, he charged me $300 to google symptoms on a computer.

Would you be upset if someone were to ask you to help with their code and you needed to Google for documentation?

It's not exactly the same thing, but it's a similar situation.

I do tend to agree with you on the rest of your concerns, especially info being used that the patient has no way to verify - but that seems tangential at worst to the product in it's current state.

[JohnFen]

> It's not exactly the same thing, but it's a similar situation.

It's pretty close to the same thing. Programmers are paid for knowing how to program, not for memorizing APIs, system calls, etc. Being able to look up details is essential because it lightens the cognitive load, allowing deeper thought to be put into the real meat of the problem. No programmer can realistically memorize every technical detail they'll need to know.

It's the same with doctors. They're paid because they know the process of diagnosing illnesses, not for memorizing Gray's Anatomy and every pharmacopoeia. Being able to look stuff up is essential for the same reason it is for programmers.

Not to mention that medicine changes, and you want your doctor to have the latest information about whatever it is that ails you.

[clemailacct1]

The tone of this reply is excessively snarky.

You clearly have a personal bad experience with your doctor - but that doesn’t mean that this potential product is a terrible idea.

[mr_mitm]

I would want my doctor to Google things. No one knows everything, but I expect an expert to know where to look. If he used Google the same way I do, he'd know which results are reliable. Doctors who finish med school and never consult a resource ever again cannot be good doctors.

[exclusiv]

Sure, but as an example, I paid a lawyer who presents that they are an expert in real estate. And I later find out they have zero understanding of legal non-conforming permits. It was a key factor I made clear upfront before I hired them.

I shouldn't have to pay for your time so you can educate yourself on the thing you purported to know before I hired you. Especially when the hourly rates are in the hundreds of dollars.

So there is some balance there. And doctors are using software that spits them out shit in real-time and then they send you on your way with some printed info you can readily find on the web.

I just had a knee issue and the doctor thought it may be a torn meniscus. Didn't have me do any range of motion movements. We just chatted and he said I think it is this. Take an xray. Bye.

I go get an xray and results come back the next day over the app. All he says in the app - "xray is normal".

So I'm thinking what the hell. That's where you leave it? So what. Should we do an MRI? What's next. You gave me an anti-inflammatory and your guess was apparently wrong. What a shitty engineer this person would be.

Tech can help in some cases. I like getting lab results back in the app. I like that I can follow up with chat later.

But I fear it's making doctors less effective. And the best ones will be the ones that maintain their traditional craft and nuance even with all the fancy new tools and tech that save them time.

Just like everyone is a React developer these days. Tech and advances can make many people sloppy. And dumber. It can push away great talent due to mandates of the tech or process. And attract new talent that is worse.

[trdtaylor1]

You are not wrong; I did not think about this until you brought it up but it's a great plan to wrap nearly free customers, then get in bed with Health Insurers to reduce cost of care by recording and transcribing all doctor conversations, then alerting to possible fraud or excessive care based on patient input against your huge DB of patient interactions. Historically recording of the patient DR interaction has always been incredibly hard sell to do for the management types. Then insurers mandate chat capture with the visit summary billed to them. Love it!

[mrtksn]

Well if you believe that you can have you fixed by Googling and still go to someone else to do the Googling you obviously have to pay.

No one is obligated to do free Googling.

Or maybe you didn’t go the for the Googling?

[nickphx]

I believe this product is to help the physicians transcribe notes and medical chart information from video/audio recordings, not diagnose.

[jimnotgym]

Last time I went to the doctor it was free.

I just like to point out the small advantages of living in Europe now and again

[nickphx]

I'm not sure you understand the definition of free.

[jimnotgym]

If I had never paid any tax in my life it would have been the same price. If I were a refuge, child, homeless person it would have been the same price. If I had lost my job due to being sick it would have been the same price.

That is my definition of free