[lofaszvanitt]

The problem is there are no reports on what counter terrorism units achieved, how many potential attacks they thwarted because it would jepoardize their work, at least that's the mantra. So it's a you have to believe us that these measures is a must situation.

The problem is, that the silicon we use in everyday hardware is a black box. Same applies to online services. We do not even know how Youtube's and other big services' and hardware units' lawful intercept/secretservice interface looks like and what options do they offer to surveil and manipulate (!) average people. So there is deffo zero insight into this matter.

Who do you believe? It's like religion if you don't know what to look for. So... choose a god and believe.

[Macha]

If we look at the number of terrorism incidents in Sweden Vs say the number of times a public official got in trouble for abusing state power as well, then the two conclusions is that either the existing mechanisms are sufficient for thwarting terrorism or the threat of terrorism is overplayed to begin with

[troyvit]

Yeah I agree. I'm starting to wonder about that mantra. If disclosing your successes endangers the work so much then maybe it's not such great work. The whole "there will always be bad actors" who want to "destroy our democracy" starts to wear thin when such high levels of secrecy are also eroding democracy.

If governments opened up more about what they're doing they might lose a few more of their secret battles (and people will die) but maybe it would be worth it when you look at the overall preservation of democratic thought. That's the ramblings of a wannabe patriot though, and not a lawyer, and lawyers are deciding all this.

[kneebonian]

> The problem is there are no reports on what counter terrorism units achieved, how many potential attacks they thwarted because it would jepoardize their work,

I used to subscribe to this but then there was the governor's kidnapping plot in Minnesota that the FBI started blowing their own horn about and making such a big deal right up until it turned out that 6 of the 13 individuals involved were in fact members of the FBI. That kinda shook my trust in the whole "we can't talk about our success because it is top secret." Excuse