[slackdog]

American checks and balances aren't relevant to the EU. The CLOUD Act requires that American companies turn over data stored in the EU without any involvement of EU due process and checks and balances, violating EU laws. The CLOUD Act effectively drafts all American companies into the American intelligence community. This is not acceptable to the EU.

punnerud is not confused.

Edit for response:

> Which European countries aren’t able to compel a company to help them by providing data in a matter of national security?

EU companies being so compelled by EU governments isn't relevant to the EU; which obviously supports that.

> This idea that all American companies are somehow arm in arm with the USIC is a ridiculous notion that isn’t supported by facts.

That is the purpose of the CLOUD Act. That's what it does. If Microsoft has a server in the EU with EU citizen data on it, the CLOUD Act requires Microsoft to hand over that data in violation of EU law if the US Government requests it. The fact that the US Government has checks and balances of its own is not relevant, the CLOUD Act still compels American companies operating in the EU to violate EU laws.

> There is a reason why most American tech companies in particular make a point to repeatedly and very loudly proclaim [...]

Their proclamations are irrelevant. US law requires them to violate EU law. As long as this is the case, the EU has no rational choice but to ban EU companies from giving EU data to American companies.

[mdhb]

Which European countries aren’t able to compel a company to help them by providing data in a matter of national security?

This idea that all American companies are somehow arm in arm with the USIC is a ridiculous notion that isn’t supported by facts.

There is a reason why most American tech companies in particular make a point to repeatedly and very loudly proclaim that they will not provide any assistance unless legally forced to do so with a subpoena. They understand that they have a global customer base and that outside the context of those checks and balances that it might be bad for business.

In fact I would even argue that many of those same companies have a far stronger record of collaborating with China than the US. Apple is an example which repeatedly comes to mind here.

[Tuna-Fish]

You do not understand the issue.

European countries can compel me to share data, and in that case I can do it legally. However, under the current law if I share data to the US government without going through the process in my local courts, I am liable for massive fines.

This is even true if I am not the entity sharing the data, but I merely placed it in the care of an US company. The problem is not that American companies are arm in arm with the government, it's that they are incorporated in a jurisdiction where the US courts have power, and because of my local laws, I must consider those courts to be a hostile actor.