[notmindthegap]

The US is a country of immigrants who for the most part came here because they valued the individual over the community. The individualism lives in the deepest roots of our culture. As a child of immigrants who was born and grew up in the US, I feel the same way you do the older I get and have been seriously considering a move abroad because of it.

Further, it feels like the only basis of a shared culture, our basic political ideals, is now up for question. So if it isn't faith, ethnicity, etc, then what is actually binding us together?

[grugagag]

> The US is a country of immigrants who for the most part came here because they valued the individual over the community.

Not enirely true, many immigrants came for better or better perceived economic opportunities and many continue to have strong but closed communities. Their children, the second generation immigrants allign themselves closer with US culture and values leaving behind communities for more individual values.

[notmindthegap]

The very act of leaving a community for better economic opportunities abroad is a demonstration of one's relative values, even if there is a hope to eventually reestablish that sense of community at some point.

[BowBun]

> The US is a country of immigrants who for the most part came here because they valued the individual over the community

I disagree with that statement, despite agreeing with the following:

> The individualism lives in the deepest roots of our culture.

There's a plethora of reasons people come here: freedom to express themselves, security, financial opportunity because they're literally living in squalor elsewhere, etc. I don't think a majority of people came because they _wanted_ individualism. They wanted to improve their situation and came to a country that had a pretty good marketing spiel.

Also if you look at immigrant communities in the US, they tend to be much closer than ones that have been here for generations (with exceptions). They create the community you claim is rejected when they come to the USA. The most active communities I've witnessed here are the Asian, Hispanic, and African social circles built around the culture that they left behind in their home countries. So I don't think your argument about immigrants leaving = individualism holds.

[notmindthegap]

"There's a plethora of reasons people come here: freedom to express themselves, security, financial opportunity because they're literally living in squalor elsewhere, etc. I don't think a majority of people came because they _wanted_ individualism. They wanted to improve their situation and came to a country that had a pretty good marketing spiel."

All these reasons are examples of valuing the individual over the community.

[BowBun]

I disagree, I think you're oversimplifying complex decisions to represent an individual's value system.

I can think the community is more important than the individual, but still leave to protect my children from starvation. Reducing human behavior to any single statement like you have done leaves many factors out, which is why solving these social issues is so insanely difficult.

[notmindthegap]

"I can think the community is more important than the individual, but still leave to protect my children from starvation."

You can think that, but your actions demonstrate otherwise. In that scenario, you valued your children's health over remaining within your community. What is special about those specific children? They are yours towards whom you feel a duty you must fulfill as their parent. And yet, there are others who would choose to stay. I'm not passing judgement on either.

[mxkopy]

> What is special about those specific children?

Ostensibly, they're part of the community. I'd argue it's not impossible, but even necessary, for the needs of a community to align with the needs of an individual. Reducing it to a "You benefit the community xor yourself" binary is engaging with black and white thinking.

[greenhearth]

It's very true that the American myth of the triumphant (and embattled) individual is a predominant socio-cultural model. But some of the major immigrant waves came as communities and continued to be so in their diaspora.