[thablackbull]

Re-reading my comments, I apologize if I came across as 'whataboutism', that is not what is intended. I just read your first link (CNN) and again, I am still left with the same question.

It first states, "...using bilateral security arrangements struck with countries in Europe and Africa to gain a widespread presence internationally..." which seems to suggest the hosts countries are fully (or at minimum somewhat) aware.

Then, they go on to say "Safeguard Defenders stumbled on the police networks while trying to assess the scale of China’s efforts to persuade some of its people to return to China..."

Fair enough, but what exactly are those people accused of? If they're being accused of fraud or other illegal activities, are those really people we want in our countries.

[JumpCrisscross]

> being accused of fraud or other illegal activities, are those really people we want in our countries

This is why countries negotiate extradition treaties. China refuses to extradite to the U.S., a matter significant when it comes to the manufacture and trafficking of fentanyl.

We also have evidence China accuses political dissidents and the like of crimes they didn’t commit. There is no independent court in China. But there are in America and Italy and London. China is free to furnish evidence of guilt and gain coöperation. They don’t. That’s telling.

[ashwagary]

>We also have evidence China accuses political dissidents and the like of crimes they didn’t commit. There is no independent court in China.

Doesnt sound as extreme as what Assange (Australian) is experiencing, adhoc legalized assassination attempts and up to 175 years from a secretive "rubber stamp" court [0]. Main difference being, the Chinese only apply this approach to Chinese people, while the US justifies its application to everyone on the planet.

The precedent has been set elsewhere but I hope China acts like a useful mirror to the many that ignore or even support this practice when their local goverment engages in it.

The Belmarsh Tribunal [0] - https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=j_QqpYATupw

[JumpCrisscross]

> Assange

This is a bad comparison. Assange is being extradited. Guantanamo Bay would be a closer analog to what China is doing. The difference is the breadth and scale.

[pferde]

> If they're being accused of fraud or other illegal activities, are those really people we want in our countries.

Whatever happened to presumption of innocence? Being accused does not mean much on its own.