[jonathanberger]

One of my favorite parts from pg's What You Can't Say is The Conformist Test:

> Do you have any opinions that you would be reluctant to express in front of a group of your peers?

Here's one of my answers if I think of HN readers as peers: Tesla made the right decision by making most of their controls touchscreen-only.

HN guidelines suggest comments should get more thoughtful and substantive as a topic gets more divisive. If you disagree with me but acknowledge thought or substance in my comment I'd love to hear why instead of garnering a downvote.

The reason I believe Tesla made the right decision is that the physical buttons on the steering wheel and stalks cover the common cases. They've made many things automatic: lights, wipers, garage door, seat heaters (edit: lights and wipers also have physical buttons). Things that aren't buttons and aren't automatic voice handles well (e.g. "set climate to 72").

And finally, and I realize most controversially, while it's still important to monitor Autopilot the technology is already to the point where it's safe in the right conditions to take your eyes off the road for some number of seconds at at time.

[fukawi2]

The tactile interaction that a physical button gives means I don't have to wait for an opportune time when I can take my eyes off the road. I can operate any function in my 32yo car without ever taking my eyes off the road. Obviously it doesn't have any self driving features, but being able to activate the wipers in less than a seconds because my windscreen is suddenly completely obscured by the car coming the other way that splashed a puddle up, or lower the volume because something has happened that needs my undivided attention, or just adjust the heating/cooling without having to think or look away is always going to be superior.

[jonathanberger]

I think this is one place where this debate goes off the rails. People don't switch cars frequently and haven't experienced or studied deeply both sets of interfaces. I completely understand why because I was the same.

I only recently switched from a 20 year old car. Wipers was one of my main concerns.

Tesla, contrary to popular belief, actually has a physical button for activating the wipers. It's one I rarely use because the automatic functionality for this works so well. There's a physical control to mute sound too.

Would you acknowledge that touchscreen controls have some benefits, such as adaptability?

[fukawi2]

Yes, being able to dynamically update and contextually change what is displayed is a benefit of a touchscreen.

I don't believe that should be relevant to mechanical features of a 2 ton weapon though. Entertainment/Nav system that aren't key features for operating the vehicle, sure, have at it.

The hardware isn't being updated remotely to add new features or functionality, so I don't see why the interface for controlling those things should need the benefit of being able to be changed.

"Keep It Simple, Stupid" has been an adage for a long time for a reason.

[MattPalmer1086]

I don't own a car. I rent one when I need one, which isn't often. So I'm not used to any particular method or interface.

I absolutely hate touch screen controls in cars. They are unsafe to use when driving, and they control things like air con you need to operate. They are also really poorly designed in most cases. I've often given up trying to figure out how to how to change something. Pretty much never have a problem with physical controls.

[h0l0cube]

> Autopilot the technology is already to the point where it's safe in the right conditions to take your eyes off the road for some number of seconds at at time.

How do you determine which seconds are actually safe to take your eyes off the road? If this can't be answered definitively, the answer is you should never have your eyes off the road. And if your answer is, 'I've done it heaps and I was fine', that's simply survival bias.

[jonathanberger]

I'm not sure I'm understanding you when you say "definitively". Do you mean if I can't be 100% sure about my answer?

The answer to your question is: the same way you determine when it's safe to cross the road on foot. When there are no cars in sight I'm 100% sure it's safe. When there are cars in sight, I'm not 100% sure but I still cross because I've developed judgement about the situation and the risks are acceptable.

[h0l0cube]

I'm not sure, as a road user, how you've not encountered traffic situations that changed from perfectly normal to dangerous very rapidly. Sometimes an obscured vehicle could pull out, or a child, or some other obstacle, can pop out of nowhere even on an otherwise quite suburban street. The examples are too numerous to mention, and certainly many would be capable of confounding an AI.

[NotYourLawyer]

How do you feel about the lack of a physical latch to open the glove compartment? I just LOVE having to go through a fucking menu tree to accomplish a task that’s been effortless and discoverable for the last N decades.

[jonathanberger]

I can tell we're going to disagree but I love the clean look of the dashboard. As a result of Tesla's product decision I've moved anything I use on a regular basis to the two large consoles. They put the glovebox button at the top of the menu tree and this product decision tradeoff hasn't bothered me.

Since it bothers you, I'm genuinely curious, what do you store in your glovebox other than I'm guessing car registration?

[frosted-flakes]

I keep my gloves in the glovebox. Also toothpicks, napkins, tire pressure gauge, books, flashlight, laptop, extra hot sauce, keyed lugbolt socket... anything and everything.

[jonathanberger]

Do you have or have you considered a car where the glovebox opens via touchscreen control? And if so, does this car have alternate storage, i.e in the center console?

[NotYourLawyer]

A gun. Or at least I used to. I certainly don’t in a Tesla.

[Brian_K_White]

This will be controversial but...

Saying "this will be controversial" doesn't make it not wrong and merely a reasonable difference of opinion and any criticism dismissable because it was predicted.

[Thorentis]

> Things that aren't covered they've made automatic: lights, wipers, garage door, seat heaters. Things that aren't buttons and aren't automatic voice handles well (ex. "set climate to 72").

This is my problem with this argument. I want a good alternative for when voice or automated features go wrong (as they so often do). I don't want the fall back to be a shitty touchscreen. I want the fall back to be something that is safe to use when driving.

[jonathanberger]

Do you mind if I ask if the car you most interact with has touch or physical controls?