[sassyonsunday]

> If I made my purchasing decisions according to the personal failings of the corporate executive teams of all of consumer and durable goods, I might as well live in a tent in the woods.

Elon Musk's involvement with the companies he is associated with is not the usual involvement that an executive team would have. His personal brand is intermingled with the products he sells and cars are a way of signaling social status whether we like it or not. There are certainly people for whom buying a new Tesla would decrease their social capital which could have negative impacts in other areas of their life (relevant to HN, social capital converts to actual capital in many cases by opening up business opportunities).

We're in a grace period right now when it comes to driving a Tesla, where people who already owned one can't really be blamed for supporting Musk, but the day has already arrived when buying a new one will signal poor taste and lack of social acumen to much of the white collar class.

Vulgarity is relative so if your crowd isn't this crowd, fine. But you can't blame people for wanting to avoid putting stigma on themselves when there are other EVs on the market nearly as good as Teslas which don't have the same toxicity.

[newZWhoDis]

Suggesting the Tesla brand is “toxic” is preposterous. Saying something like that in real life would get you laughed at.

[sassyonsunday]

> Saying something like that in real life would get you laughed at.

All you've told me here is that the people you personally associate would laugh at the idea that Tesla is a toxic brand. The world is not made up of a single social group with a single set of norms. In the groups I associate with, and no we are not blue haired SJWs I am married with a family in the suburbs and work a boring corporate job, Tesla is toxic.

Some things I try to keep in mind as much as possible:

- We are all operating from different frames of reference.

- Social networks are fundamental to our survival: people will go to great lengths to stay in the good graces of their families, friends and associates.

- "Society" is a huge tapestry of interlocking social networks, each with its own internal logic and reward systems.

- The logic and reward systems of the most powerful networks tend to leak into all the others over time to some degree.

[vgt]

Perhaps you should Google "Tesla brand damage" and see a plethora of brand professionals opining that this is exactly what's happening.

Here's one being quoted [0]

[0] https://www.carscoops.com/2022/12/tesla-investors-and-custom...

[toomuchtodo]

Oh no, signaling poor taste. The travesty. Let others live their life according to the whims of “the white collar class.” I’m going to enjoy what I enjoy, and I’d like to associate with like minded folks.

[sassyonsunday]

I said that if you don't associate with the crowds I'm talking about it doesn't matter.

Ironically pretending that we don't play social signaling games and critiquing others for playing them is itself a sort of social signaling game. These games can't be avoided because they are a fundamental part of human interaction, so much so that when we aren't good at playing those games for whatever reason we are unable to function properly in society and are pathologized as a result.

[benj111]

>Oh no, signaling poor taste

...

>I’d like to associate with like minded folks

And how do you signal to like minded folks?

A car specifically might not be important to you as a signaller but if you do want to associate with like minded folks you are going to seek to emulate and fit in with those groups. That's kind of how society and humans work.

[brookst]

Sure, you do you. Plenty of people fly confederate flags, and they have every right to do so. Just as other people have every right to judge them. This is the way.

[AYBABTME]

Sounds like some stuff bored 1800s European aristocrats would care about, busy living their now pointless performative lives while revolutions are brewing and the industrial revolution is about to put the petite bourgeoisie in control of everything.

[sassyonsunday]

I understand what you are implying. Elon Musk has aligned himself with what appears to be a power structure that aims to replace the current dominant social order. If a social revolution comes due to war, economic restructuring or some other black swan event and The Daily Wire becomes the new CNN and Saturday Night Live skits come straight from The Babylon Bee, yes, the crowd that sees Teslas as toxic will be marginalized.

We'll see if that comes to pass. I'm guessing it won't, but if it does I'll adjust accordingly to the new reality as will we all.