[travisjungroth]

> 2m each is not "Fuck you" money perhaps but it is enough to comfortably retire

That is exactly what "fuck you" money means. It's not about having so much money you couldn't possibly want for anything. People will always want. It's about having enough that you're not beholden to anyone for your basic needs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJjKP8vYjpQ&ab_channel=Youtu...

[marcusverus]

Right!?

I always thought it meant something like "enough money to tell literally anybody to go fuck themselves without fear of the economic consequences". But I did a little googling and apparently "fuck you money" is one of those things that doesn't really have a clear-cut definition. Which is weird.

In theory there is some specific dollar that you earn which puts you over the line into "fuck you" money. If you're a dollar away from financial independence, are you worried about saying "fuck you" to your boss? Hell no! Which must mean that you're already safely in "fuck you" territory.

So that the magical greenback--the one with the serial number ending in "FU"--must come way earlier. Maybe it's the buck that puts your bank account into five figures for the first time. Or the one that tops off your 6-month emergency fund. Hell, if the dollar that puts you in the dos commas club doesn't send a surge of "fuck you" power running through your veins... you might just not be the "fuck you" type.

[dasil003]

It really doesn't work that way, for several reasons.

First, you can't predict what will happen with the economy vis-a-vis your investments and cost-of-living. Sure there are rules of thumb, but depending your age and the current situation, assumptions like "I can perpetually do a 4% drawdown" may or may not be reliable.

Second, the ability to say FU to everyone is not a black and white decision. Perhaps you value earning more to live a higher lifestyle in the short-term, with some optionality to say FU if things go sideways. Other people might have been burnt and would rather live a life of poverty than be forced to capitulate to The Man one more time. In the immortal words of Lawrence from Office Space: "you don't need a million dollars to do nothing". Most people probably fall somewhere in between.

And last but not least, declaring financial independence raises new existential questions which people may not be ready to answer. Having a job gives a baseline social connection and sense of communal utility. To actually declare financial independence poses a risk of alienation, which may have no upside once the immediate threat of short-term dependence on one's employer is removed.

[travisjungroth]

You don't sound like the "fuck you" type.

[ghaff]

Well, yes. It depends on what your requirements are. For some people ~$80K/year without benefits isn't what they're looking for to coast through life.

[travisjungroth]

I recommend watching the clip if you haven't. It doesn't that you actually go an retire, it means that you can.

[ghaff]

I'm not sure how that contradicts what I wrote. It's above US median income, albeit without benefits. So, it's of course reasonable for someone to decide they don't need to work any longer with that income stream while others may feel differently.

[travisjungroth]

At least for what I'm saying, it's not that someone would "decide they don't need to work any longer". This is what contradicts what you're saying.

It is about significantly improving your economic baseline, your p90 negative outcome. You can be making a million dollars a year and still be needy as hell. You need to keep your job, need to your investments stay up, need interest rates to stay down. If you're leveraged, there's a decent chance you'll go broke on a long enough timeline. And you'll always be partly aware of it. Your baseline is getting a job you hate so you don't go homeless.

If you have 2 million in the bank and don't leverage too hard, your baseline is being the average American while working 0 hours a week. You can do that until you figure out whatever is next, instead of sending out resumes.