[bigmattystyles]

Shouldn't the author have also mentioned cheap drywall? To me that led to worse yet much faster and cheaper construction. It's also so easy to work with that even I learned how to do most things (slowly but well). My expensive bay-area wall feels like a carton box and I think it's because i grew up in a masoned house. (I know masoned buildings are not viable in CA due to earthquakes, but man does my house feel like it could just get blown away by a mild gust here)

[maherbeg]

They actually wrote a whole article on dry-wall and theorizing on what the next iteration of it could look like https://constructionphysics.substack.com/p/comparing-process...

[hammock]

I read the whole thing and didn’t really see what the next iteration of wall materials (for general household use) would look like. I saw a discussion of mostly plastic alternatives, and some kind of robot drywall finisher.

[danans]

> Shouldn't the author have also mentioned cheap drywall? To me that led to worse yet much faster and cheaper construction. It's also so easy to work with that even I learned how to do most things (slowly but well). My expensive bay-area wall feels like a carton box and I think it's because i grew up in a masoned house

If it's a production builder built house, it might have 3/8 inch drywall.

1/2 or 5/8 inch drywall makes a big difference to how solid a wall feels but that usually only happens in custom high end builds.

[jeffrallen]

In Europe we use Fermacell, which is like drywall but much more substantial. It is made from recycled paper and cement.

[dmtroyer]

I think balloon framing preceded drywall by quite a long time.

[csours]

They have talked about drywall in a previous post.

[lotsofpulp]

In what ways does drywall make a house worse?

[peatmoss]

The article linked in this thread mentions the strengths of plaster—the tech that preceded drywall. Plaster has some nice aesthetic properties, good fire resistance, good sound isolation, can be shaped into organic contours. All those things make it great, though I hate the mess of working with old work.

[bombcar]

Drywall provides a significant amount of structural strength- it braces the walls something pretty fierce even if you can kick it.

It also lets all the “look good” labor be done at the very last moment.

In my personal opinion the only thing that comes close is shiplap and it don’t look as good to some and doesn’t fireblock as well.

[danans]

It also can serve as a decent primary air barrier as long you don't put big holes in it.

[bombcar]

Or any holes at all - it turns out that a TON of moisture can get through even a small hole: https://www.buildingenclosureonline.com/articles/88629-perme... (third image)

[clairity]

no, drywall is basically chalk sandwiched between paper and provides no structural strength to a wall. studs provide compressive strength while plywood provides shear (and some impact) strength to walls. metal strapping is usually added to provide tensile strength. plaster is backed by lath (wood slats), which provides some shear strength akin to plywood backing.

[lazide]

Bwaha, that’s just not true.

As long as the paper is halfway intact, drywall is very difficult to remove and provides significant strength to a wall. It’s a composite material, and excellent fire barrier.

It’s really obvious when it’s up compared to not.

It’s not as much as lathe and plaster, but lathe and plaster is extremely difficult to work with in every other way, and far more labor intensive.

Plywood on a wall is important for shear strength, but lathe and plaster doesn’t replace it. Properly designed earthquake resistant shear walls became a thing long after lathe and plaster were phased out.

[clairity]

i probably overstated my point by saying drywall has no shear strength, but we seem to agree that drywall < plaster & lath[0] < plywood in that respect. i'd suggest you've also overstated the strength of drywall as "significant". it's not nothing, but against an earthquake, it's approximately nothing. plywood backing, of course, is the minimum required by code for earthquake resistance.

plaster & lath is harder to work with, but has many superior qualities (re: moisture, sound, heat, malleability) that it makes it worth it in many residential cases (not so much commercial, where reconfiguration is more frequent).

[0]: a lathe is a machine tool

[engineer_22]

It's considered rude to laugh at an interlocutor's comment.

You could bring an example of code or calculation instead of anecdote to demonstrate your point.

[engineer_22]

I was going to agree with you, as a university trained engineer it seemed absurd to count drywall towards structural calculations, but then I did some research.

TIL gypsum board is given some shear strength credit in the code books:

https://up.codes/s/shear-walls-sheathed-with-other-materials

I wouldn't have guessed it, I wouldn't trust it if it was close to failure, but there it is.

I think the least attractive aspect is how drywall fails catastrophically, and once it's broken the strength can't be restored. This is probably why I didn't expect it to be counted in structural calcs.

[CamperBob2]

Weak elements secured in multiple places become strong ones. Potentially extremely strong ones.

The workbenches in my shop consist of multiple cheap, crappy pressed-wood folding tables from Office Depot, secured to each other on multiple sides with equally-cheap metal brackets. You'd think this would result in a rickety, unsafe platform that would blow apart in a stiff wind or buckle under light vertical load, but instead they are stouter in all three dimensions than most actual retail-grade workbenches. (And I don't have to feel bad about drilling into them!)

I can see drywall working exactly the same way, given enough studs and enough nails. The problem to be solved -- and the lesson I learned when I hacked these workbenches into existence -- isn't necessarily insufficient rigidity, it's too many degrees of freedom.

[bombcar]

Yeah, I wouldn't really count it for much on actual load bearing walls, but it is noticeable on non-load bearing walls, they become more stable with drywall.

The most noticeable place I've seen it is in garages; the ones that are drywalled on the inside don't seem to lean as much as those that aren't.

[clairity]

well that's good to know! i had an implicit assumption of load-bearing walls in my prior comments, which is why they skew the way they do. of course for non-load-bearing walls, drywall is perfectly fine, but i'd still choose plaster & lath (backed by plywood for seismic reasons) over drywall.

for a dream home, i'd love steel or mass timber for the exterior framing to reduce (maybe eliminate) interior load-bearing needs, so that interior layout is maximally configurable while still allowing lots of windows. expensive, but dreamy!

[SkipperCat]

Drywall does provide structural strength. While it may be easy to to punch a hole in drywall, it is very hard to cause it to fail via shear. Think about a square made of wires. You can push on it and the joint's angles will deform from 90 degrees.

Now, if you nail a piece of cardboard to the square, the corners will stay square when force is applied because the cardboard resists that force. You could even use paper and get the same results.

[frosted-flakes]

Plaster and gypsum board (drywall) can be used together. The author's own house uses plastered gypboard, and from what I understand plastered gypboard is still extremely common in Europe and around the world.

[sgerenser]

It’s also pretty common in New England (Boston area especially) although almost unheard of outside that area in the U.S.

[asmithmd1]

We had rehab work done when we moved to a Boston area house and they skim coated everything with plaster as standard of practice. That is definitely not the standard anywhere else I have lived.

Another regional difference is they put the powder room light switch next to the door on the outside, why? Has anyone seen this in any other area?

[dsr_]

It's a Massachusetts standard, explained to me as an early safety procedure before GFCI was invented -- and probably dating back to early exposed wiring. Separation of water and voltage.

[erik_seaberg]

Only the treated surface is water resistant, so you might get mold or rot inside.