[sorenjan]

Telegram has been used by opposition and protestors in Hong Kong, Russia, and Belarus. Where are the reports of arrests based on intercepted Telegram messages? Russian police force people on the street to show their messages, but that kind of rubber hose attack is the same for all chat apps. Are there any police investigations from democratic countries where the investigators used Telegram communication in a prosecution?

I haven't seen anyone show that Telegram uses bad encryption. I've seen plenty of people repeat the "don't make your own crypto implementation" mantra, but just like the "don't optimize prematurely" truthism it's not always true. Where's the exploits?

And then there's another reason, most communication isn't particularly sensitive. Dinner suggestions, memes, thoughts on the latest season of The Crown... I chat about the same things that I talk about on the unencrypted phone "line", or at a cafe surrounded by strangers. If Telegram turns out to be unsafe, I wouldn't have any issue with continuing using it for everyday stuff, and using a different app for secrets. Compartmentalizing is probably a good idea anyway, I use my real name on Telegram with my family.

[d3nj4l]

> Are there any police investigations from democratic countries where the investigators used Telegram communication in a prosecution?

Literally a week ago in India: https://torrentfreak.com/telegram-discloses-user-details-of-...

> I haven't seen anyone show that Telegram uses bad encryption

The bigger point isn't that Telegram uses "bad encryption", it's that it isn't encrypted by default in all scenarios. This is a conscious choice they've made.

> If Telegram turns out to be unsafe, I wouldn't have any issue with continuing using it for everyday stuff, and using a different app for secrets.

Great, now every time you're talking on the "other" app the State knows you're talking about something sensitive. The point of encrypting everything is to ensure that encryption - by itself - is not a sign of illicit activity.

[sorenjan]

> Literally a week ago in India: https://torrentfreak.com/telegram-discloses-user-details-of-...

That wasn't by breaking the encryption, it was by court order.

> it isn't encrypted by default in all scenarios.

It is using encryption in all cases, but it's not using end to end encryption in all cases. I know plenty of people will argue that it's the same thing as no encryption, but by using encryption you then force anyone who want's to eavesdrop to go through court to get the data from Telegram, and not just listening on the same Wifi network. Saying it's unencrypted is disingenuous.

[19h]

They disclosed the phone number. A week later, they introduced a no-SIM signup. Go figure.

[dodgerdan]

> Telegram has been used by opposition and protestors in Hong Kong, Russia, and Belarus.

How successful have those protestors been? In each case it seems like the government was always one step ahead of them and all there. So I don’t think it’s a giant leap to think they’re communications are compromised.

[sorenjan]

I don't know what instances you're referring to, but few protests happen without any spectators so maybe the fact that a protest will happen isn't a well guarded secret. Was any of the organizers compromised because of Telegram?

The FBI says they can't get message content, and only IP and phone number for convicted terrorists.

https://www.malwarebytes.com/blog/news/2021/12/heres-what-da...