[mgbmtl]

That rant views freedom as purely individual, and not collective, or more likely the compromises in other to have both.

It also doesn't explain the difference between CBDC with traditional debit/credit card systems, which do impose a ton of restrictions to some in order to protect freedoms for others (whether demonitizing a porn site that does not hold uploaders accountable, or reducing tax evasion).

[xs83]

We still have cash right now - that is the important distinction. You can choose to put your cash under your mattress, self custody has always been a thing.

Our bank accounts have some legislated protections and even if they decide to de-platform me from my bank account they have to provide me with the money (sanctions aside) in that bank account in the form of cash or a medium that can be exchanged for cash.

If cash ceases to exist then what? If the government decides that I (or a group) are to be blocked from transacting, without cash then what happens?

We currently have choice - CBDCs will remove that choice for everyone and unilaterally grant governments an absurd amount of power - as demonstrated in that thread

[mgbmtl]

I think that's key, legislation. We rely on legislation one way or another.

As geeks we're always trying to think of technical solutions, but over and over again, what guarantees our freedom are strong and robust democratic institutions that make it possible to address the social issues.

[xs83]

I think we are also of the mindset that "If we have the capability to do things ourselves in such a way that removes the need for legislation then why can't we"?

If you lose $500 in cash because you tucked it in your pocket and dropped it you don't expect recourse from the government, you might report it missing and hope for the best but that's about it.

So why does Crypto need such heavy regulation with the regulators saying that "well you need protection from losses". We don't - we need the freedom to be able to choose what to do with OUR money - even if those decisions are dumb.

[WinstonSmith84]

you compare pear and apples. CBDC is to be compared with your current saving account, whereas a debit card is how you can spend the money from that account, whether it's a saving account or a CBDC. Likely debit cards will still exist with CBDC, assuming not everyone has a smartphone.

The "advantages" of CBDC, in regard to governments, is that this is a sort of entry in a database, possibly every dollar having an "id", perfect for tracking. They will know what you bought, when, etc. Also, governments could delete that entry to remove dollar from your account. They also could simply lock that account since the CB/government issue this currency as it's not controlled anymore by your local bank. In a sense, governments already have some of these capabilities, but it's a lot of procedures to access and block the money (remember the Canadian truckers?). And at the moment, it's even harder to track the flow of money in the current system. CBDC is going to make such control much easier and faster.

[agingtiger83]

The most significant thing about a CBDC that it's a liability on the government or the central bank in this case. It's a legal tender while a checking or savings account isn't

[lzaaz]

There is no such thing as "collective freedom".

[andrekandre]

isnt "freedom to assemble", "freedom to cooperate/incorporate", "freedom of the press" etc collective freedom/rights?

[influxmoment]

Use of one bank's credit card is voluntary and not mandated by the central authority. It's the difference between choosing to only read the New York Times or a government enforcement of one source of news

[hikingsimulator]

Is it? I can't see living in Europe without an IBAN for instance -- and the card that comes with one. And that's not something the government is enforcing.

Same in the US, you can't not have a credit card because of the credit score system there. Use of a credit card is mandatory because you need it to financially "exist."

[HPsquared]

There's a big difference between being able to borrow money, and being able to function.

[Schroedingersat]

Not when "being able to borrow money" is used as a proxy for employability and whether to rent to someone.

[influxmoment]

Competition and divided roles keeps these systems somewhat functional. Put them all under one authority and almost certainly see an increase in abuse

[tpm]

Living without a bank account ('IBAN') in the EU would be hard today. Living without a debit card is still doable, but becoming less and less practical. Living without a credit card is completely normal, many people do not own one, including me.

[searchableguy]

> and the card that comes with one. And that's not something the government is enforcing

They are. Most countries impose additional regulatory compliance on businesses which deal with cash making it costly to handle.