[remarkEon]

> It was normal to have incredibly painful teeth, probably not healthy.

Is this actually true? I thought archaic humans had much better dental outcomes because their diets had a small fraction of the sugars that modern diets do. Could be wrong but I was definitely under the impression that poor dental health was more a function of modern diet and not something that necessarily existed throughout history.

[harry8]

I'm no expert, this could be wrong, what I was told by an ancient historian was even the Pharohs with all their wealth had terrible painful teeth from sand in food which was ubiquitous until fairly recently. I have recollections of dental records of pre-historic persons being reported as pretty nasty.

Feel free to nit-pick that example, there are an absolute plethora of others. When did surviving appendicitis become a thing? What was the median life expectancy for a newborn baby at various times in history? Calling out the fetishism of humans in a "natural state" needs to be done. Just as there are things we can learn from our pre-historic existence. Evidence is obviously the required thing not just amusing anecdote about how we have totally "lost our way."

[remarkEon]

Yeah I should’ve made it clear in my comment that I agree with you, I think the fetishism of pre-historic humans is a little odd. Of course there’s things to learn, but it’s strange to think that a period when you died from something as trivial as a minor infection is somehow ideal. I was only nitpicking on the dental thing, because eating so much sugar really is relatively new in human history and is the source of a number of health problems, beyond bad teeth.

[OJFord]

Probably not so modern in regions with native sugar cane? E.g. doesn't jaggery (unrefined cane sugar reduced to a semi-solid block) production in India and thereabouts go back centuries?

Certain palms are also (and have been for... Again I don't know, but I believe 'a very long time') 'milked' for a sugary sap that's drunk fresh or fermented.

[lossolo]

Yeah, this seems inaccurate, tribes in Africa that still live hunter-gatherer lifestyle have good teeth without cavities. It changed after humans moved from hunter-gather to agriculture.