In reality I enter my phone passcode very infrequently because I use a fingerprint reader. I have set a long PIN since I don't want it to be brute forced. Because of the horror stories I hear of law enforcement and abuse of power, if I have a run in with a cop, turning off my phone is one of the first things I do. In a stressful situation where I am facing potential harm to my body or my family I can very easily see myself forgetting what that long, infrequently typed PIN is.
In the U.S. generally [0] a court can force [1] disclosure of a password or location of a physical key or whatever unlocks access to documents whose existence and contents is a "foregone conclusion".
The idea is that "we know you have contraband <details>" so your being made to produce that contraband is not a violation of the 5th amendment right to not self-incriminate.
This idea seems rather twisted to me, but this is what the courts have gone with. There might be some protection against other incriminating documents being found this way than those that were being sought, but I'm not sure.
Looping back to your comment, if it is a foregone conclusion that you do know the password, then "I forgot it" won't be a defense. But if it can be shown that you haven't used that password in a long time, then it might be a defense (but idk really).
IANAL. Do not rely on any of this.
[0] This may vary by state, but I believe in Federal court it works this way.
[1] Via the threat of contempt of court incarceration until the defendant or witness complies.
Does pressing the power button five times still disable biometrics?
Edit from sibling comment link with alternate easier method to hard lock: “Just press and hold the buttons on both sides. Remember that. Try it now. Don’t just memorize it, internalize it, so that you’ll be able to do it without much thought while under duress, like if you’re confronted by a police officer. Remember to do this every time you’re separated from your phone, like when going through the magnetometer at any security checkpoint, especially airports. As soon as you see a metal detector ahead of you, you should think, “Hard-lock my iPhone”.”
This doesn't seem to work on my iphone 7 with ios 15.7.1. If the screen is off, nothing happens. Or if I happen to push the power button slightly before or after the volume key, the screen will turn on and touch id works as usual. If the screen is on, but the phone is locked, nothing happens either. The screen will just turn off at some point. The phone can still be unlocked normally.
What does work is pushing only the power button when the screen is on for a few seconds. This is a dual press (1. turn on screen; 2. start shut down procedure). Or pressing the power button five times, whatever the screen state. But that also activates the emergency call countdown.
It’s worth mentioning here that as long as long as you have a few seconds notice you can force your Face ID enabled iPhone to require a passcode the next time it’s unlocked.
I don't have an iPhone with FaceID to test this, but supposedly you need to be looking at the phone as well, so it should be fairly easy to avoid unlocking the phone under duress (consequences notwithstanding).
(not a lawyer or french) but generally yes - it's your responsibility to give the password to the police, forgetting it would be equivalent to forgetting to pay at a store or forgetting to put on a seatbelt while driving - it may be accidental but still illegal. I don't know of any laws where you can legitimately claim ignorance
That is a looong shot! The responsibility for my passwords is mine and sole mine!
Other thing is being negligent with password security, and a breach leading to damage of property of life... but forgetting a password is not a crime! never.
Is this your belief of the law as it stands or how you feel the law should be?
"forgetting a password is not a crime" is a statement of fact, and the only thing required to make it a crime is a law saying it is a crime. "Crime" is not some universal absolute, what is and is not can obviously change drastically over time.
Yeah I'm not saying this is what I think it correct - it's just how the law seems like it works. Ultimately you'd have to convince a jury and I don't think most people would believe "I just happened to forget it when the police asked for it". In the US you aren't required to give the police your passcode, but they do have a legal right to use your face/fingerprints without your permission, so they can freely search if there's only a biometric lock but not a passcode. Very weird but that's how the laws were written
"Btw. with new iPhone they just need to hold it close to his face while handcuffed."
Honest question. Do people on HN actually travel with this enabled on their iphone? Like, the ability to just hold you to a wall with your phone and open it?
It can always go to that, due to nothing you’ve done.
Mistaken identity, planted evidence (from someone else, like drugs put in your bag by a handler for picking up by a compatriot in the destination, but caught before then, or by bored police!), political targeting (like you’re the ‘wrong’ nationality, and the country you’re traveling to wants some leverage), etc.
Muggers or bandits also don’t exactly ask if today is a good day either.
> Do people on HN actually travel with this enabled on their iphone?
I have nothing to hide, but I travel with a secondary phone that I wipe before crossing international borders, to which I’ll happily give law enforcement access.