[afry1]

Indeed. It feels unsafe to follow the "rules of the road" on a bike because the rules were created for an entirely different kind of vehicle.

I think about this a lot when approaching a stoplight or stop sign.

For any road user, where is the most dangerous part of any road? You guessed it, the intersection.

When is an intersection safest? When it's empty.

So, for a cyclist, it makes the most sense to cross through the most dangerous part of the road when it is devoid of danger; i.e., when it's empty, or when other cars are stopped.

This of course gets a little dicey when you consider protected turns, leading pedestrian intervals, jaywalking, or anything else which would make that "empty" intersection a little less empty and therefore unpredictable and dangerous. But generally speaking, I feel way safer running a predictable red light than crossing it with moving traffic.

[u801e]

> It feels unsafe to follow the "rules of the road" on a bike because the rules were created for an entirely different kind of vehicle.

The rules of the road[1] were first developed in the early 20th century before motor vehicles were very common. They were designed for operators of vehicles like animal driven vehicles, cyclists, and early motor vehicles (anything on wheels).

> So, for a cyclist, it makes the most sense to cross through the most dangerous part of the road [an intersection] when it is devoid of danger; i.e., when it's empty, or when other cars are stopped.

> [...]

>

> But generally speaking, I feel way safer running a predictable red light than crossing it with moving traffic.

I don't see how the second part follows from the first. Your assertion is that it's safe to cross an intersection when it's empty or when other cars are stopped, but then you say you feel safer running a red light. But when the light for cross traffic is green, cross traffic will neither be stopped or not in the intersection.

Statistically, you're far more likely to get hit by cross traffic compared to same direction traffic, so while you may feel safer, you're actually putting yourself in more danger.

[1] https://www.enotrans.org/wp-content/uploads/RulesOfTheRoad.j...

[eckmLJE]

Here is a grossly simplified illustration:

I'm approaching an intersection on my bicycle and the light ahead is red. The motor vehicle traffic is stopped at that red light. I pass by that stopped traffic and get closer to the intersection. My head is largely above the cars stopped at the crosswalk and I have good visibility. I scan the entire intersection (from an elevated view standing up on my pedals, without any pylons or mirrors obstructing my view as in a car) and note that there are no pedestrians in or entering the crosswalk, and no motor vehicles approaching cross-wise (the intersecting street that has a green light). I can clearly see that the way is clear and it is safe to proceed.

The law would say I should stop and wait for the light to turn green. However, when the light turns green, all the motor vehicle traffic anxiously accelerates and jockeys for position in the intersection. If I'm in a bike lane, some of the traffic may be attempting to turn across my lane (and right into me) to beat the pedestrians into the crosswalk. If I've taken the lane and I'm between a car ahead of me and one behind me, the car behind me may get upset that I'm not moving quickly enough and honk, swerve around me, tailgate me, etc. This is unsafe and frightening, and I seem to be slowing other people down.

Instead, if I arrive at that red light and I can clearly visualize that it is safe for me to proceed, I will then proceed through the light and get out of everyone's way while having an impact on basically no one. Still, the folks in cars will be very upset with me, and sometimes still honk, or write angrily on message boards about bike scofflaws, because I'm breaking the law (I suspect it's more that they're upset they're stuck in their car and experiencing classic road rage), even though if I had remained with them at the light, I'd likely just be getting in their way.

---

To move on from the grossly simplified example, there is a matter of degree to how clear the intersection is. Maybe there is a pedestrian just entering the crosswalk, but I'm in the center of my lane a good 15 feet away from them. That still seems safe to me. Or there is a car approaching the intersection that has the green, but they're still a good 50 feet away and I have plenty of time to make it through the intersection.

On the one hand, some more reckless/careless riders will make closer calls than I would think are acceptable or safe. And on the other hand, many pedestrians who don't have honed spatial awareness will insist they were "almost hit" by a cyclist when it really wasn't close and the person could have suddenly sprinted and not been in danger.

As I learned how to ride in the city, I had to start safer and gradually find my way to what I considered acceptable. I couldn't rely on the law to tell me, because if I followed the law, I'd be risking my life unnecessarily.

I'm not trying to say it's clear or obvious what the rules should be, but just that in the current situation, applying the existing laws evenly to cars and bikes doesn't make sense.

[u801e]

> I scan the entire intersection (from an elevated view standing up on my pedals, without any pylons or mirrors obstructing my view as in a car) and note that there are no pedestrians in or entering the crosswalk, and no motor vehicles approaching cross-wise (the intersecting street that has a green light). I can clearly see that the way is clear and it is safe to proceed.

It really depends on the intersection, traffic level, how many lanes of cross traffic there are, how fast they're traveling, and if there are any visual obstructions (e.g., parked vehicles, poles, building features, etc). In my experience, many signal controlled intersections have too much traffic to really proceed straight through or make a left without having to wait quite a while for a gap.

> all the motor vehicle traffic anxiously accelerates and jockeys for position in the intersection.

They may do that after the intersection, but most people don't try changing lanes within the intersection. What I do if I have a platoon of traffic build up around me in an intersection while waiting at a light is to proceed through the intersection and pull over at the far side. Once the platoon has passed, I then take the lane on the empty road behind them.

If you run the light instead, then when the light changes to green, they're going to catch up to you while moving at speed as opposed to starting from a complete stop.

> I'm in the center of my lane a good 15 feet away from them

At 10 mph, you're moving around 15 feet per second. That's not enough distance or time to react.

> Or there is a car approaching the intersection that has the green, but they're still a good 50 feet away

At car moving at 25 mph is going about 37 feet per second. They'll get to you a little over a second.

> On the one hand, some more reckless/careless riders will make closer calls than I would think are acceptable or safe.

The problem is that when they cut it too close a collision or a crash caused by evasive acion on the part of the motorist(s) occurs. This is one example[1].

> I couldn't rely on the law to tell me, because if I followed the law, I'd be risking my life unnecessarily.

Exactly in what way would following the law put your life at risk? You mentioned earlier that you felt that motorists would be slowed down by you taking the lane, or you would be at risk of a right hook by remaining in the bike lane. It's clear that the former is a perceived risk, while the latter is an actual risk. In that case, I would just take the lane, proceed through the intersection and move off to the side to let the motorist who was behind you pass (as I mentioned earlier). One you're past the intersection, the motorist isn't going to turn across your path.

> applying the existing laws evenly to cars and bikes doesn't make sense.

In my opinion, the only laws that don't make sense are the ones that require cyclists to keep as far right as practicable on roads with marked lanes and/or require them to use a bike lane. Those laws I ignore, but I still follow the general slow vehicle law that requires use of the right lane when going less than the normal speed of traffic. I just ride in the middle of it and move to the side to encourage motorists to pass when safe to do so.

[1] https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manches...