[okasaki]

How can private property exist in such a society? If you and I both claim to own some land and we can't come to an agreement, isn't it going to be decided with superior force?

How is this society mutually beneficial by definition? If I own the fields and decide to destroy the produce (it's mine, I can do whatever I want?) while the locals starve, this is fine right?

[roenxi]

> isn't it going to be decided with superior force?

Yes. There is always going to be a superior force and it decides who owns what.

Practically, the point of anarchism is that the force should be limited (voluntarily, like how armies in a healthy democracy voluntarily subordinate themselves to the voters) to the absolute minimum role possible. For example, the popular configuration right now is that the group that controls the strongest army (ie, 'the government') is also seen as responsible for providing healthcare and welfare. The anarchists think this is stupid because there is no reason to think that there is an organization that is simultaneously good at so many things at once.

> How is this society mutually beneficial by definition?

Anyone using force to achieve their aims gets removed from society, so all that is left is people transacting mutually beneficially. It isn't so radical, that is close to what we have now. The vision is basically you go to the shops and buy stuff.

[pixl97]

>Anyone using force to achieve their aims gets removed from society,

I think I see a fatal flaw in the logic here....

[roenxi]

That part is also something that most societies do right now. What do you see as the flaw there?

[pixl97]

That there is any barrier for the force to remain limited beyond the barriers already established in our current governments. In this argument it seems that we've established that force is needed. But there is no compelling argument put forth by anarchism that establishes a reasonable control mechanism for limiting said force. Yea "You can't tell my what to do by force" seems like a good mantra, but it really sucks the moment someone else gathers up enough people voluntarily (or monitarialy) to subdue the limited resistance your type of governance allows. The "We'll all get together and fight the enemy" sounds good until you realize that about half the battle put forth by the enemy will be psyops in getting the anarchist to fight themselves allowing them to be even more easily defeated. Once a significant portion of the anarchist are convinced to give up and not fight the enemy, and if they give up those that will fight they will be spared, the remaining pockets of resistance will much more easily collapse. You're back to 'anarchist nationalism" to prevent just this from happening.

[roenxi]

> But there is no compelling argument put forth by anarchism that establishes a reasonable control mechanism for limiting said force.

That is already a solved problem. The force chooses to exert itself in a limited way. The largest military in the world currently works like that - the US army does whatever the US Congress tells it to. They don't have to, the army has the guns and the US Congress only has annoying geriatrics and comfortable seats - not much of a contest if the army makes it one. The army chooses to limit itself because they understand it will lead to the best outcome for them.

The radical part of anarchism isn't the use of force, it is the argument that the people who exert force shouldn't be trying to solve social problems with force. The barrier to that isn't the behaviour of the army, it is the beliefs of the polity.

[abecedarius]

How can territorial animals not be fighting each other all the time?

http://www.daviddfriedman.com/Academic/Property/Property.htm...

[mistrial9]

.. a bulk of theology for millennia has addressed this exactly; informally in culture, too.

[_0ffh]

> How is this society mutually beneficial by definition

I wrote "voluntary social interactions [...] are by definition mutually beneficial". A voluntary interaction implies that all participants in the interaction have chosen to do so by their own free will. That implies that they value going through with the interaction higher than to forego the interaction. Hence, it benefits all of them.

> If you and I both claim to own some land and we can't come to an agreement, isn't it going to be decided with superior force?

That's merely a technical problem. A land register might be a solution.