[tryitnow]

"The issue is money. Which nobody is proposing more of for our state universities."

A few things. First of all, I'd say a pretty good proportion of the best programmers I know were self taught (i.e. didn't go to college or else majored in something completley unrelated to CS, e.g. French lit).

Second, there are growing opportunities to learn code online. I don't even need to mention any of them to this crowd.

Third, most of the CS majors I talk to say that CS curricula are out of date and almost always have been (at least with respect to what employers are looking for, in terms of theory it's less true).

Fourth, as the author makes clear other universities are sweeping in to fill the gap left by UW.

So, is this really a problem? I guess it's a problem for UW because they don't have the sense to move resources from weaker programs to CS. But then again, is that what's really going on? It could be that UW is simply wishing to enhance it's program by being more selective (and the UW people in the article might disagree with that). or it could be that UW's administrators are just morons, that wouldn't be the only case of stupid mismanagement in American universities.

I just don't see what the big deal is. With today's opportunities nobody is being denied the opportunity to learn coding.

Of course, maybe people really, really want to learn actual academic CS instead of just getting employable skills. I seriously doubt that though.

[jc4p]

I'm a self taught programmer. I'm currently on my lunch break at a job that pays me just under 6 figures a year. I work and live in Seattle and I'm very glad that UW rejected me, twice.

While the teachers interviewed in the story are amazing, I'm glad UW rejected me because I don't think I'd be were I am right now with their education. I've helped numerous high school friends who are now taking Computer Science classes learn what they need to learn for their assignments and the problems they have are just so non relevant that it scares me.

This isn't a case of someone complaining "Why do I have to learn Calculus, I'll never use it!" (because I actually do use Calculus every day), but rather complaining about "why have I had to explain for loops to four different sets of hard working and studious friends, the day before their assignments are due?"

I'm fairly certain that if any of my friends currently attempting a Computer Science degree from UW want to work at the level I do professionally, they'll have to study a lot on their free-time and learn things on their own rather than follow along with the classes they're taking.

Note: This doesn't include people who have contacted me asking for her saying they're only taking Computer Science just because they hear it pays well.

[Maven911]

The hours dont match when you posted this message and you said you are on your lunch break, unless you take it at 5 pm

[seiji]

It's been a while since I've debunked the bunk of an education post. I hope I'm not too rusty. (The formatting is horrible and I apologize. I can't decide between italics for quoting the parent or fixed width indents. Right now the fixed width indents are the parent being quoted.)

  First of all, I'd say a pretty good proportion of the best programmers I know were self taught

I've noticed people tend to self-select talent. People who go to MIT think MIT churns out the best programmers in the world. People who went to community college think community colleges turn out the best programmers in the world. I'm curious now -- did you go to university?

  there are growing opportunities to learn code online.

Hm. I thought we were talking about universities and cs, not programming.

  CS curricula are out of date and almost always have been

Out of date depends on your mindset and the circumstances. Are they teaching using pascal and visual delphi in 2012? Yes, that's behind the times. Are they teaching you scheme, smalltalk, and C instead of Python, Objective-C, or Ruby? That's not behind the times, it's historical immersion. You have to know where you come from to know where you are going.

  with respect to what employers are looking for

bzzt You just lost the "why go to college" argument. Thanks for playing.

  nobody is being denied the opportunity to learn coding.

Imagine I recalled that old quote about astronomy and telescopes here.

  really want to learn actual academic CS instead of just getting employable skills. I seriously doubt that though.

Ah ha! Now we are back to my first question -- did you go to university?

[tryitnow]

Yes, I went to university and I actually believe in the value of education. I have the student loans from my MBA to remind me of that.

But what works for me won't work for everyone.

However, you're point about selection bias is a good one, it's just not applicable in terms of educational experience in my case, but in my case it is applicable in terms of geography - I live and work in the SF Bay Area, so educational credentials are just not valued as much here).

But I would contend that the rest of the world might learn a thing or two from the SV model of focusing ruthlessly on results and not pieces of paper.