[ClumsyPilot]

Ah, so the chaos and lack of documentation in my company is really protection against chinese spies! Clever!

On a more serious note, I find it quite unfair that Western conoany go into China to take advantage of loose labour laws and child labour, and then they complain when loose IP laws hit them. Like you knew what the deal was from the outset.

Lastly not every society believes in the concept of intellectual property, it is not even clearly defined - for instance EU does not issue software patents.

[mehrdada]

You just took one angle. I find it unfair that Facebook is banned by China while China can deploy TikTok in the US market, for example, to demonstrate the opposite.

[ClumsyPilot]

Looking at how Facebook was fucking with UK elections and brexit, maybe it should be banned everywhere

[toyg]

It's not the opposite, it's the same problem: globally dis-harmonised legal systems.

[iancmceachern]

I mean that's the thing, that wasn't the deal. No company, at all, would sign that agreement. Usually there is an nda, some kind of business agreement that says they won't steal your idea etc. and then they do. It's not like a company goes to China or another lower cost to manufacture country and signs an agreement to give them their business.

[bee_rider]

Contracts and deals are subordinate to the laws of the country in which we'd like them to be enforced. It's not like a company goes to China and expects tight IP laws.

And hey, our (American) IP laws were a lot less strict when we were catching up to the British Empire.

Countries generally try to set their laws up to benefit their industries (to the extent possible).

[iancmceachern]

I agree with all this. Where does all the ip theft via hacking fall into this view? By this logic hat should be held accountable to the laws of this country, no?

Lots of links to Wikipedia lists of examples in other threads here.

[bee_rider]

I don't think it is possible to simplify it down beyond what has actually happened. Hackers for China in the US fall under US jurisdiction and so they'll be treated pretty harshly. Hackers for China in China -- it's complicated, if they are doing something their government wants them to do, they probably won't be.

Then the US will try to incur some diplomatic cost for China, which does have a pretty bad reputation on this front... it's all part of the big game.

[ClumsyPilot]

You are telling me giant conpanies with 100 people in legal did not study previous Chinese court cases and did not know that IP laws there are poorly enforced? I knew about this for 20 years and they didn't?

All developing nations, whether China or Russia or Somalia, don't enforce some laws. Sometimes it's lack of strong state, sometimes it's lack of beurocratic capacity, or a concious decision. Anyone going into these countries is aware of this.

IP, Labour laws and bribes in case of China.

Clearly western companies take advantage of the two latter, and cry foul about the former. Massive hypocracy.

Meanwhile western government dont enforce their own laws for any kindof accoutability of major business leaders. Chinese will answer for IP theft on the same day CEO of Nestle will go to jail for taking advantage of child labour and slavery in their supply chains.

So probably we will have to wait for judgement day

https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable-business/2016/feb/01...

[iancmceachern]

I agree Nestlé should go to jail for child labor. The thing is they're a European company. We can't just lump everything into "western governments". That's like half the world.

The thing is,anybody these IP theft cases are also against Chinese law, they his choose to ignore it when it benefits them.

Corruption is everywhere, it's not an excuse to strive for anything less than right and truth. "Bevause they did it" is not a good reason.