[koonsolo]

Western media is not controlled by the goverment, so they are free to report on anything they want. I saw them interview pro-russian people in those regions right in the battle areas.

On YouTube I follow Denys Davydov, a Ukrainian pilot that reports about the war. A few days ago he showed a video of a Ukrainian helicopter flying close over traffic, and he was critiquing how irresponsibly and dangerous that was. He claims to know that road and that is was far from the battlefield. So even him as a Ukrainian is able to try and be as objective as possible.

News can be objective. The claim that western media is full of propaganda is just kremlin propaganda.

[SanjayMehta]

> The claim that western media is full of propaganda is just kremlin propaganda.

This made me chuckle.

[koonsolo]

You have to ask this question: How is the government controlling the media?

In Russia's case, it's pretty clear. They have laws to prohibit free press, jail time for claiming things opposite to the Kremlin.

In some other cases, it's more subtle. In Hungary, Orban's influence on the media is very high, and not healthy for a democracy.

But if you claim that the most objective news sources in the west still show straight-up propaganda, I would love to see some evidence of that. Any evidence, like a journalist that is fired over going against a government. Or laws, or some other influence from the government straight to media companies.

[cudgy]

You are only focusing on government punishing journalists and journalists complying due to fear. This ignores journalists being lazy by accepting and printing leaked stories from government as truth without any verification. Another example is not reporting on topics due to fear of losing their job or social status because it goes against a popular narrative.

[SanjayMehta]

This is from 2021:

https://europeanjournalists.org/blog/2021/08/26/ukraine-pres...

[SanjayMehta]

One example from the latest podcast from The Telegraph: they spent a lot of time talking about the wheat from Ukraine going to the "global south."

But a few days ago a Turkish minister said over 60% was sold to Europe, so which is it?

[MagnumOpus]

Luckily in 2022, you don't have to take news at face value.

5 seconds to enter "Ukraine wheat exports by country" into Google, yielding a USDA page saying: "In 2021, Ukrainian wheat exports were valued at $5.1 billion, with Egypt, Indonesia, Turkey, Pakistan, and Bangladesh as the primary destinations."

Telegraph 1 - Turkish politician 0.

[SanjayMehta]

To coin a phrase, the nice thing about news websites is that there are so many to choose from:

Here's the BBC quoting the UN:

> However, UN figures show that the bulk of Ukrainian food exported in the last three months has been going to Spain, Turkey, Italy, China and Netherlands.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-61759692

See why I'm confused?

[raxxorraxor]

How is the government controlling the media?

Mainly through access. If you don't report favorably, your government sources might withdraw. Sources that provide you with exclusive information that you can provide first. There are of course unimaginable other venues to enforce compliance to a certain framing. There is also documentation how this was achieved in the past.

I saw how the press quickly turned people in favor of the Iraq war. It was clear propaganda. You can see the same stuff happening today with different enemies. Yes, Russia is a despotic state, but you are a victim of disinformation as soon as that prevents you to demand accountability at home. Because that would be your job as a citizen of a democratic state and what you can influence.

[koonsolo]

Let's take the US as example: you claim that news sources will not discredit the president or government?

[raxxorraxor]

Depends on how favorable a candidate is. The US does have independent media, but also large networks that certainly push interests.