[logicalmonster]

Have you ever considered that trying to regulate speech to avoid "toxicity" creates a feedback loop that actually intensifies "toxicity"?

Online debate used to very intense and used plenty of naughty language and what would be considered cancellable slurs, but never felt deeply personal. The winner of the debate was the person who presented the best ideas in the clearest fashion. People of all stripes: whether Dirty Commies or Filthy Libertarians could go to an off-topic board, have pages long debates all together about abstruse topics like who in the hell should build the roads, and then go back to shooting the shit about basketball and computer games without blinking an eye.

People had the chance to freely vent. This is a good thing. It's bad when pressure builds up in a system when it cannot be released.

Today, Internet discourse takes a different form. Partially due to iDevices and social media making the Internet accessible to every low-IQ person out there who has very little business ever sharing any ideas with anybody, petty and unintelligent people debate by trying to bait the other side into rule-breaking so they can appeal to daddy-corporation to hit the other guy with the ban hammer. Every minor disagreement drips with pure resentment and intensity. Just one minor moment of weakness where somebody borderline-arguably breaks a rule becomes a gotcha moment where the other side can feign being outraged so they can try and get the other guy banned.

This modern safe space Internet is the real "toxicity" generator.

[greendude29]

Hate speech is not a joke. It predates the Internet. It has led to (and will lead to) massive atrocities. Some of the most well understood atrocities of the 20th century (Rwandan genocide, Nazis, Anti-muslim attacks in India, many others) were engineered via hate speech.

Without regulation, Internet tools will be used to (and are being used to) conduct mass scale human political change including manufacturing consent for war, hate, colonialism, etc.

The world is big, and not all centered around the American take on politics (Commies and Liberatrians). It's also much much bigger than "daddy-corporation" and minor disagreements. The Internet is a tool that governments and political actors use for control.

I would very highly recommend reading up on Hate speech outside the American context of "free speech" and the Internet.

[logicalmonster]

> The Internet is a tool that governments and political actors use for control.

You want to avoid atrocities and genocide. Great! So do I. Isn't it a great thing that we're both on the same page with that? We don't disagree on ends, but we do disagree on means.

The Internet is a tool used for control. We both agree with that. Now think about what you want. You want to protect people from an authoritarian regime, yet you also want to have systems in place for speech to be controlled. These ideas are in conflict. If speech is controllable, it's a tool that will be used by people who actually want genocide.

An atrocity isn't going to come because some edgy teens call each other a bundle of sticks while discussing political ideas online or use some distasteful language while trying to blast each other in some game.

But an atrocity can come if there's systems in place to restrict allowed speech. Do you think the Uyghurs are allowed to freely use the Internet and fully communicate their experiences with the outside world? Or are the systems that China has in place to regulate China's Internet used to control what information gets out and further their abuse?